59: Felix + Emil Abrahamsson - Fantasy Climbing League Creators

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.700
what i like to view comps as is you get to have

00:00:02.700 --> 00:00:05.000
like these perfectly curated boulders probably

00:00:05.000 --> 00:00:07.200
suited to your level depending on what level

00:00:07.200 --> 00:00:10.140
of the comp you're entering i told my friend

00:00:10.140 --> 00:00:11.980
about this fantasy league and he told his friends

00:00:11.980 --> 00:00:13.660
that weren't even climbers and they said they

00:00:13.660 --> 00:00:15.880
would be so psyched to just try this out and

00:00:15.880 --> 00:00:17.679
they don't even watch competition climbing but

00:00:17.679 --> 00:00:19.280
this would make them interested in watching it

00:00:19.280 --> 00:00:23.199
like emma said we really don't want to promote

00:00:23.199 --> 00:00:28.179
gambling um of course and so So I think in a

00:00:28.179 --> 00:00:32.000
way, Janja could see a downfall, like she might

00:00:32.000 --> 00:00:36.299
play second a few times in comps. Welcome to

00:00:36.299 --> 00:00:38.439
another episode of the That's Not World Climbing

00:00:38.439 --> 00:00:40.899
podcast. I'm your host Jinni, and I'm excited

00:00:40.899 --> 00:00:44.479
to introduce my guests for today, Emil and Felix

00:00:44.479 --> 00:00:47.759
Abrahamsson. You likely know Emil from being one

00:00:47.759 --> 00:00:50.340
of the OG climbing YouTubers who has also competed

00:00:50.340 --> 00:00:53.429
in a few World Cups for Sweden. With his brother

00:00:53.429 --> 00:00:56.090
Felix, they've started a new Fantasy Climbing

00:00:56.090 --> 00:00:58.530
League platform. In this episode, we'll learn

00:00:58.530 --> 00:01:00.350
about how the Fantasy Climbing League works,

00:01:00.549 --> 00:01:03.009
how they feel about sports gambling and climbing,

00:01:03.310 --> 00:01:06.349
who their top picks are for their teams, and

00:01:06.349 --> 00:01:08.909
their predictions for all things comp climbing.

00:01:09.250 --> 00:01:12.489
I hope you enjoy this episode with Emil and Felix.

00:01:21.709 --> 00:01:24.030
Please pardon this brief intermission, but I'm

00:01:24.030 --> 00:01:26.890
excited to talk about Madrock's newest and softest

00:01:26.890 --> 00:01:29.609
shoe yet, the Remora Pro. If you like being able

00:01:29.609 --> 00:01:31.689
to feel the chips you're standing on, and you

00:01:31.689 --> 00:01:34.409
like not having to worry about standing on sketchy

00:01:34.409 --> 00:01:37.150
volumes in competitions, then this is the soft

00:01:37.150 --> 00:01:41.109
shoe for you. They also have a crazy 3D heel

00:01:41.109 --> 00:01:43.209
that allows you to get more surface area when

00:01:43.209 --> 00:01:46.030
heel hooking, and inserts that lock your heel

00:01:46.030 --> 00:01:48.269
into the shoe no matter how hard you're pulling.

00:01:49.159 --> 00:01:51.040
Feel free to message me if you have any questions

00:01:51.040 --> 00:01:53.560
about the shoes or sizing. And you can use the

00:01:53.560 --> 00:01:56.799
discount code NotRealClimber for 10 % off your

00:01:56.799 --> 00:01:59.120
entire Mad Rock order. Thank you to Mad Rock

00:01:59.120 --> 00:02:01.219
for helping to sponsor the podcast. Now back

00:02:01.219 --> 00:02:03.840
to the show. You said you'll be together after

00:02:03.840 --> 00:02:07.359
on the April 23rd? Yes, that's correct. Right,

00:02:07.500 --> 00:02:09.780
Felix? That's when you guys get to ARCO. Yep.

00:02:10.340 --> 00:02:13.240
What are you guys doing there? So I live here

00:02:13.240 --> 00:02:19.789
in ARCO since December. Yeah. And now the family's

00:02:19.789 --> 00:02:21.969
coming to visit for a few days. So Felix and

00:02:21.969 --> 00:02:25.310
our mother are popping over to say hi to the

00:02:25.310 --> 00:02:29.370
sun after the grim Swedish winter. Okay. At first

00:02:29.370 --> 00:02:33.590
I thought you meant sun as in like a boy. I was

00:02:33.590 --> 00:02:37.129
like, wait, did I miss something very big? Yeah,

00:02:37.129 --> 00:02:40.469
sorry about that. That was unclear. And that's

00:02:40.469 --> 00:02:43.090
the first time? Yeah, first time being in Arco

00:02:43.090 --> 00:02:45.689
at all. It'd be really cool. What was the reason

00:02:45.689 --> 00:02:49.080
for the move? um i am currently in a position

00:02:49.080 --> 00:02:52.099
where i can move around a little bit more than

00:02:52.099 --> 00:02:54.819
most other times in life so i figured it's time

00:02:54.819 --> 00:02:56.759
to try something outside of sweden for a little

00:02:56.759 --> 00:03:00.919
while and uh yeah arco was a pretty premium destination

00:03:00.919 --> 00:03:03.740
for it you know it's no place to be it's a good

00:03:03.740 --> 00:03:07.199
place to be outdoor climbing and stuff yeah there's

00:03:07.199 --> 00:03:10.099
like so many sport routes to get on there's a

00:03:10.099 --> 00:03:11.919
lot of fun climbers it's kind of like a little

00:03:11.919 --> 00:03:14.969
it's very much a climbing town All the stores

00:03:14.969 --> 00:03:17.930
have climbing gear in them. Everything is just

00:03:17.930 --> 00:03:20.969
climbing everywhere. So it's perfect for somebody

00:03:20.969 --> 00:03:25.490
who's heavily addicted to the sport. I don't

00:03:25.490 --> 00:03:27.189
know too much about Arco because I don't know

00:03:27.189 --> 00:03:29.830
that much about outdoor climbing. But that's

00:03:29.830 --> 00:03:31.370
okay because this is all about competitions.

00:03:31.509 --> 00:03:34.590
And we'll get into that today. Where do you live,

00:03:34.650 --> 00:03:37.629
by the way? I'm in San Diego, California in the

00:03:37.629 --> 00:03:41.520
US. You been? not to san diego but we went to

00:03:41.520 --> 00:03:43.919
uh the mad rock headquarters last year it's a

00:03:43.919 --> 00:03:46.280
little bit around la and then we popped over

00:03:46.280 --> 00:03:48.580
to vegas so i've been in the area a little bit

00:03:48.580 --> 00:03:51.199
and we actually took a tour when we were like

00:03:51.199 --> 00:03:57.020
15 and 18 with our family from i think it was

00:03:57.020 --> 00:04:00.340
la to san francisco so we missed san diego yeah

00:04:00.340 --> 00:04:04.120
um i also did live in vegas for a year so i was

00:04:04.120 --> 00:04:06.780
there for a bit But I left because I wanted more

00:04:06.780 --> 00:04:10.060
like comp style setting. I did not do that in

00:04:10.060 --> 00:04:12.400
Vegas if you went to any of the gyms there. Oh,

00:04:12.419 --> 00:04:14.979
yeah, I heard. Yeah. Did you used to compete

00:04:14.979 --> 00:04:20.360
or do you compete? No, I did not. I just prefer

00:04:20.360 --> 00:04:26.480
I had dreams. I have I had some dreams of doing

00:04:26.480 --> 00:04:30.560
some competitions that I've kind of set aside

00:04:30.560 --> 00:04:34.689
for now because of work and also injuries. But

00:04:34.689 --> 00:04:38.870
I wanted to, still want to, but maybe next year.

00:04:38.949 --> 00:04:41.689
This year, it's not happening for me. Well, so

00:04:41.689 --> 00:04:44.110
it sounds like you both competed. To some degree.

00:04:44.370 --> 00:04:47.910
I mean, Emil a lot more than me. I guess I competed

00:04:47.910 --> 00:04:53.470
in kind of a casual way. I never really aspired

00:04:53.470 --> 00:04:56.709
much to compete. I was always really bad at it.

00:04:57.069 --> 00:05:02.189
I guess I'm bad at almost all aspects of competition.

00:05:02.939 --> 00:05:06.839
I'm bad at flashing. I'm bad at the style. I

00:05:06.839 --> 00:05:09.879
was decent at kind of like the mental game and

00:05:09.879 --> 00:05:15.040
strategy, but that's definitely not enough. But

00:05:15.040 --> 00:05:21.240
I definitely do enjoy it. It's really fun. So

00:05:21.240 --> 00:05:23.899
I wish I was good at it. I think I'm along the

00:05:23.899 --> 00:05:26.480
same lines as you then, yeah. So then how did

00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:29.360
you both get into starting out climbing and then

00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:33.230
a bit of competing and actual competing? i mean

00:05:33.230 --> 00:05:36.029
felix is the the og of the two he picked it up

00:05:36.029 --> 00:05:39.990
a few months before me um back in 20 you started

00:05:39.990 --> 00:05:42.829
in 2011 right felix and then i started in 2012.

00:05:43.529 --> 00:05:47.420
yeah So we were teenagers at the time. We kind

00:05:47.420 --> 00:05:50.060
of missed. It's a bit of a shame, actually, because

00:05:50.060 --> 00:05:52.240
we did technically start climbing when I was

00:05:52.240 --> 00:05:55.139
like eight or nine with our parents. But we only

00:05:55.139 --> 00:05:57.939
went a few times and then we dropped it to play

00:05:57.939 --> 00:06:01.000
video games and do other stuff instead. And then

00:06:01.000 --> 00:06:04.620
picked it up like six or seven years later. And

00:06:04.620 --> 00:06:06.120
I'm kind of like, oh, damn, would have been fun

00:06:06.120 --> 00:06:08.500
to start that early. Missed so many years. So

00:06:08.500 --> 00:06:11.160
technically you did start it early and then you

00:06:11.160 --> 00:06:14.160
decided that games would be more fun. Yeah, I

00:06:14.160 --> 00:06:16.500
don't know what was going on. Definitely a bad

00:06:16.500 --> 00:06:18.980
call. And which one of you is older? That would

00:06:18.980 --> 00:06:22.120
be me. He's three years older. So you started

00:06:22.120 --> 00:06:24.360
climbing slightly later, like in your teenager

00:06:24.360 --> 00:06:27.019
years. When did you both start competing? I think

00:06:27.019 --> 00:06:29.939
I did my first competition very shortly after,

00:06:30.060 --> 00:06:32.259
like maybe one year after I started climbing.

00:06:32.339 --> 00:06:35.279
I was around 16 or 17. Because we have this thing

00:06:35.279 --> 00:06:38.439
in the Nordic countries called the Nordic Championships,

00:06:38.819 --> 00:06:43.100
which is like... a very very nice format actually

00:06:43.100 --> 00:06:46.800
it's the nordic countries so finland uh sweden

00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:49.560
denmark norway and iceland and they all get together

00:06:49.560 --> 00:06:53.079
for this like quite official big competition

00:06:53.079 --> 00:06:55.920
but it's at the same time almost a little bit

00:06:55.920 --> 00:06:58.220
casual like everybody wants to join in if it's

00:06:58.220 --> 00:07:01.120
around it's not that like pro level necessarily

00:07:01.120 --> 00:07:05.620
um so it's and it makes the setting quite a bit

00:07:05.620 --> 00:07:07.860
easier so even if you've only climbed for a year

00:07:07.860 --> 00:07:10.199
and you're Well, I mean, if you're a little bit

00:07:10.199 --> 00:07:12.819
maybe skilled and committed to climbing, you

00:07:12.819 --> 00:07:15.180
can be there and sort of get some zones, maybe

00:07:15.180 --> 00:07:18.300
a top or two here and there. So it's quite a

00:07:18.300 --> 00:07:21.139
fantastic format to get into competition climbing,

00:07:21.339 --> 00:07:23.480
actually. And that was across all the countries?

00:07:23.939 --> 00:07:25.980
Yeah, yeah, it is across all the countries. I

00:07:25.980 --> 00:07:29.379
mean, I was in the youth at that time. So it's

00:07:29.379 --> 00:07:33.420
maybe like 50 kids or something or so competing

00:07:33.420 --> 00:07:37.220
at that time. I don't think it went very well,

00:07:37.279 --> 00:07:39.060
but it was really, really fun. Yeah, exactly.

00:07:39.180 --> 00:07:41.620
It's not that big. It's not like, you know, a

00:07:41.620 --> 00:07:44.680
thousand kids getting together or anything. And

00:07:44.680 --> 00:07:46.579
it's a great way to connect to the community

00:07:46.579 --> 00:07:49.300
and sort of get in touch with people who are

00:07:49.300 --> 00:07:51.300
equally as psyched on climbing from the other

00:07:51.300 --> 00:07:54.660
countries. Would you say it's still like that

00:07:54.660 --> 00:07:58.000
size nowadays? I'm not sure about the youth category.

00:07:58.160 --> 00:08:01.399
The seniors, Felix, you've done the Nordic probably.

00:08:01.579 --> 00:08:03.959
Have you done it more than me? I've never done

00:08:03.959 --> 00:08:08.540
the Nordic championships, but. My perception

00:08:08.540 --> 00:08:11.339
of this is that it's definitely a lot bigger

00:08:11.339 --> 00:08:15.439
and more serious now. At least the Swedish, like

00:08:15.439 --> 00:08:17.100
the national comps in Sweden, they've really

00:08:17.100 --> 00:08:19.019
tried to kind of step it up and make it a little

00:08:19.019 --> 00:08:24.779
more prestigious. When I got into competition,

00:08:24.899 --> 00:08:29.800
that was in 2016 or 15 or something, and that

00:08:29.800 --> 00:08:33.440
was the Swedish championship. i was just i was

00:08:33.440 --> 00:08:35.320
deep into outdoor climbing at the time and we

00:08:35.320 --> 00:08:38.779
had gone to we had gone there so em could compete

00:08:38.779 --> 00:08:42.220
and i was just outside climbing and uh i had

00:08:42.220 --> 00:08:44.299
a project and i said okay if i do this project

00:08:44.299 --> 00:08:48.539
then then i'll join the competition and then

00:08:48.539 --> 00:08:50.899
i did it and i came there like the day of the

00:08:50.899 --> 00:08:55.419
comp and just can i can i be in i think that's

00:08:55.419 --> 00:08:57.759
kind of like yeah i mean that's kind of like

00:08:57.759 --> 00:09:00.080
how the vibe was back then you kind of just like

00:09:00.080 --> 00:09:03.639
showed up and you could you could just pop in

00:09:03.639 --> 00:09:08.840
and and uh and participate and uh it's yeah it

00:09:08.840 --> 00:09:12.000
was very casual very like yeah very casual vibes

00:09:12.000 --> 00:09:15.700
and nowadays it's you have to qualify and uh

00:09:15.700 --> 00:09:19.179
yeah it's it's uh the competition is really stiff

00:09:19.179 --> 00:09:22.399
now like i would say the back then it would be

00:09:22.399 --> 00:09:25.000
like maybe the the top level like the top six

00:09:25.000 --> 00:09:27.460
climbers were really strong and then the after

00:09:27.460 --> 00:09:29.559
that like the level dropped quite a bit but nowadays

00:09:29.559 --> 00:09:33.620
you have like at least 20 people that are actually

00:09:33.620 --> 00:09:36.240
really strong yeah growing sport for sure i was

00:09:36.240 --> 00:09:38.259
trying to remember which trip it was because

00:09:38.259 --> 00:09:41.220
we had uh we were basically living in in cow

00:09:41.220 --> 00:09:43.399
manure for a few days before this comp i think

00:09:43.399 --> 00:09:45.519
and just came in like absolute dirtbags and it's

00:09:45.519 --> 00:09:47.980
a nice memory of mine because we uh yeah it was

00:09:47.980 --> 00:09:49.919
just when we really got into competition climbing

00:09:49.919 --> 00:09:52.139
i would say that 2016 trip if it's the one i'm

00:09:52.139 --> 00:09:55.840
thinking of at least yeah yeah yeah yeah we were

00:09:55.840 --> 00:10:00.600
intense yeah yeah came in probably like Not at

00:10:00.600 --> 00:10:02.480
all ready for a competition, just super wrecked,

00:10:02.480 --> 00:10:05.700
but it was a good time for sure. And so that

00:10:05.700 --> 00:10:09.200
was your first one? For me, though, well, yeah,

00:10:09.200 --> 00:10:12.539
I would think so, unless there was some very

00:10:12.539 --> 00:10:14.460
casual competition before that, but I don't know.

00:10:14.600 --> 00:10:16.460
So you guys didn't really go through this whole

00:10:16.460 --> 00:10:21.639
youth comp scene growing into a senior category

00:10:21.639 --> 00:10:23.879
kind of thing? I mean, I started when I was 19,

00:10:24.019 --> 00:10:26.899
so I was well past that already. I guess you

00:10:26.899 --> 00:10:29.899
might have done some, Emil, or? so i did that

00:10:29.899 --> 00:10:33.340
nordic youth championship um and then i went

00:10:33.340 --> 00:10:35.720
straight for the senior championships when i

00:10:35.720 --> 00:10:40.440
was 18 and i made that year when we were when

00:10:40.440 --> 00:10:42.360
you first competed felix that's when i made my

00:10:42.360 --> 00:10:45.879
first finals back in 2016 at the swedish championships

00:10:45.879 --> 00:10:50.059
that is and from there i i went on to sort of

00:10:50.059 --> 00:10:53.559
just do the nationals for a few years until

00:10:53.559 --> 00:11:00.100
so then i'd made finals like five years in a

00:11:00.100 --> 00:11:02.840
row and was starting to feel ready to do more

00:11:02.840 --> 00:11:05.419
uh like bigger competitions and join the national

00:11:05.419 --> 00:11:08.700
team uh there in 2020 just before covet actually

00:11:08.700 --> 00:11:12.980
so it's not the best timing uh so i ended up

00:11:12.980 --> 00:11:16.159
doing my first world cup in 2021 in meiringen

00:11:16.159 --> 00:11:19.840
how did those go oh well that's the thing so

00:11:19.840 --> 00:11:24.519
this well there's two things the style that for

00:11:24.519 --> 00:11:26.759
competitions in sweden was very very different

00:11:26.759 --> 00:11:29.580
from the world cups and the difficulty of course

00:11:29.580 --> 00:11:32.320
as well so making finals at the swedish championships

00:11:32.320 --> 00:11:35.840
at that time definitely didn't qualify you for

00:11:35.840 --> 00:11:38.899
the world cups like physically speaking like

00:11:38.899 --> 00:11:41.600
for the country yes you want to have people representing

00:11:41.600 --> 00:11:44.799
so it makes sense to qualify that way um but

00:11:44.799 --> 00:11:47.600
there was so so much to learn in terms of how

00:11:47.600 --> 00:11:50.620
you climb at the world cups the style The holds,

00:11:50.700 --> 00:11:52.860
just everything was quite different. So the first

00:11:52.860 --> 00:11:54.820
couple of competitions, I got pretty smacked

00:11:54.820 --> 00:11:58.200
and struggled quite a lot. But the thing is,

00:11:58.259 --> 00:12:01.360
it's just a tremendously fun experience regardless.

00:12:02.179 --> 00:12:06.080
So many inspiring climbers to, you know, just

00:12:06.080 --> 00:12:09.740
chill around with, learn from. So I was very

00:12:09.740 --> 00:12:11.620
happy to do them, but I don't think I made more

00:12:11.620 --> 00:12:15.720
than a few zones at my first World Cup and struggled

00:12:15.720 --> 00:12:19.610
quite a lot, got shut down. A few zones isn't

00:12:19.610 --> 00:12:21.610
bad. I think a lot of people would be quite happy

00:12:21.610 --> 00:12:24.389
with a few zones. Yeah. So you're both still

00:12:24.389 --> 00:12:27.850
quite involved in the climbing scene. Emil, you

00:12:27.850 --> 00:12:30.830
obviously do YouTube. Did you start that before

00:12:30.830 --> 00:12:33.970
you actually did that like World Cup and Marine

00:12:33.970 --> 00:12:37.909
Games? Yeah, I started YouTube in 2019. So I

00:12:37.909 --> 00:12:40.129
guess the year before, yeah, the year before

00:12:40.129 --> 00:12:43.029
my first, like before I entered the national

00:12:43.029 --> 00:12:46.690
team. then i was just doing youtube and the goal

00:12:46.690 --> 00:12:48.750
at first was to focus a lot on outdoor climbing

00:12:48.750 --> 00:12:51.870
i've always been sort of in between the two worlds

00:12:51.870 --> 00:12:55.610
um i'm very passionate about rock climbing um

00:12:55.610 --> 00:12:59.009
but i think it's quite quite easy to get hooked

00:12:59.009 --> 00:13:01.490
on comps like you can just practice the same

00:13:01.490 --> 00:13:03.070
thing over and over again and knock your head

00:13:03.070 --> 00:13:05.090
against the wall and that's a really really cool

00:13:05.090 --> 00:13:06.909
element to the sport there's always new moves

00:13:06.909 --> 00:13:10.269
and it's generally like i mean you can be on

00:13:10.269 --> 00:13:12.690
a slab for like six hours and not get incredibly

00:13:12.690 --> 00:13:17.080
tired which is really really fun Um, so yeah,

00:13:17.220 --> 00:13:20.279
it was a bit of a transition between the two.

00:13:20.340 --> 00:13:22.259
I think I covered some of the world cups on the

00:13:22.259 --> 00:13:23.620
channel in the beginning and thought that that

00:13:23.620 --> 00:13:25.220
was really, really fun as well. Just talking

00:13:25.220 --> 00:13:28.139
about the mentality that went behind it. And

00:13:28.139 --> 00:13:31.820
then Felix, you, um, are a machine learning engineer.

00:13:32.500 --> 00:13:36.220
Exactly. So I built like, yeah, a few climbing

00:13:36.220 --> 00:13:40.179
apps. Yeah. I, I always thought like if I, um,

00:13:40.570 --> 00:13:42.570
If I retired from work or if I, for whatever

00:13:42.570 --> 00:13:44.370
reason, didn't have to work, I would spend all

00:13:44.370 --> 00:13:48.370
my time just building climbing apps. It's a lot

00:13:48.370 --> 00:13:52.070
of fun to combine those two things. Yeah, I built

00:13:52.070 --> 00:13:56.049
board climbs, a spray wall app. I want to say

00:13:56.049 --> 00:13:59.450
the first spray wall app that had automatic hole

00:13:59.450 --> 00:14:01.490
detection. Now there's at least one more out

00:14:01.490 --> 00:14:04.669
there that has that. So there I kind of combined

00:14:04.669 --> 00:14:07.529
my machine learning knowledge to build that.

00:14:08.690 --> 00:14:11.210
And, yeah, it's an app where you can, like, you

00:14:11.210 --> 00:14:13.529
can upload a photo of your spray wall and it

00:14:13.529 --> 00:14:15.330
finds the holes for you. And then you can, like,

00:14:15.330 --> 00:14:18.389
create problems on there and log them and share

00:14:18.389 --> 00:14:23.509
them with your friends and so on. And then, yeah,

00:14:23.590 --> 00:14:28.029
now built the fantasy climbing sites. Yeah, and

00:14:28.029 --> 00:14:30.870
we'll definitely get into that in a bit. Just

00:14:30.870 --> 00:14:33.909
kind of curious. So I'm also, I'm like a software

00:14:33.909 --> 00:14:36.690
engineer. How much AI do you use to build your

00:14:36.690 --> 00:14:44.080
apps nowadays? Well, quite a lot, I would say.

00:14:44.519 --> 00:14:48.460
I mean, coming from a machine learning background,

00:14:48.879 --> 00:14:54.139
I will definitely jump on these tools to try

00:14:54.139 --> 00:14:58.240
them as soon as they come, right? And I use it

00:14:58.240 --> 00:15:01.919
a lot, for sure. It would be crazy not to. It's

00:15:01.919 --> 00:15:04.539
massively helpful, which has also kind of led

00:15:04.539 --> 00:15:08.179
me to think, well this sort of dream of retiring

00:15:08.179 --> 00:15:10.720
and just building climbing apps it's kind of

00:15:10.720 --> 00:15:13.879
like it's gonna saturate really fast because

00:15:13.879 --> 00:15:16.159
of how fast you can build things like there's

00:15:16.159 --> 00:15:18.659
it's not that much time that you have to actually

00:15:18.659 --> 00:15:23.879
spend anymore so it's it's a sad in a way i would

00:15:23.879 --> 00:15:27.759
say yeah so your dream is crushed now i mean

00:15:27.759 --> 00:15:30.840
i i kind of feel like like that that must be

00:15:30.840 --> 00:15:35.289
a little bit what like artists feel like or I

00:15:35.289 --> 00:15:37.090
don't know, people that have AI take over their

00:15:37.090 --> 00:15:40.269
jobs. I mean, it's like, I feel also like it's

00:15:40.269 --> 00:15:44.970
different than for an artist because an artist

00:15:44.970 --> 00:15:47.169
is doing something creative and it's still probably

00:15:47.169 --> 00:15:50.870
fun to create art, even though an AI can produce

00:15:50.870 --> 00:15:55.230
like mass produce art. But with programming or

00:15:55.230 --> 00:15:59.470
software development, it's just problem solving.

00:15:59.610 --> 00:16:01.970
It's kind of like just beating your head against

00:16:01.970 --> 00:16:04.700
the wall sometimes. And so it's always going

00:16:04.700 --> 00:16:06.980
to be, you're always going to want to use the

00:16:06.980 --> 00:16:08.779
AI tools. You're not just going to go back to

00:16:08.779 --> 00:16:13.799
programming yourself for the fun of it. So I

00:16:13.799 --> 00:16:16.460
don't know, it definitely feels quite sad to

00:16:16.460 --> 00:16:18.940
me. I guess now it's more about, I guess, like

00:16:18.940 --> 00:16:22.299
the ideas you come up with rather than if you

00:16:22.299 --> 00:16:25.879
can code it or not. Yeah, no, I still feel like

00:16:25.879 --> 00:16:28.759
we're kind of at a point where it helps to also

00:16:28.759 --> 00:16:32.580
be a software engineer. Like you do. you can,

00:16:32.580 --> 00:16:34.740
you can build a lot better software and like,

00:16:34.740 --> 00:16:38.000
you can make it more bug proof and whatever.

00:16:38.399 --> 00:16:41.360
And with, cause it's still like, it's a tool

00:16:41.360 --> 00:16:43.720
that will help you. It's not a replacement entirely,

00:16:43.860 --> 00:16:48.220
but I also, I mean, I also suspect that in, in

00:16:48.220 --> 00:16:50.980
within a few years, it will probably complete,

00:16:51.100 --> 00:16:53.320
like you won't have to have any software development

00:16:53.320 --> 00:16:59.399
knowledge. Okay. Yeah. I hope not. I hope not.

00:16:59.440 --> 00:17:02.179
I'm scared of that too. Right. But like, It just

00:17:02.179 --> 00:17:03.899
kind of feels like it's going in that direction.

00:17:04.279 --> 00:17:07.319
And I don't know. I don't know this any more

00:17:07.319 --> 00:17:09.519
than anyone else. Yeah, we'll see how it goes.

00:17:10.259 --> 00:17:12.400
I feel like it's slightly more about the idea,

00:17:12.519 --> 00:17:14.700
which is why I'm excited that you guys created

00:17:14.700 --> 00:17:16.759
the Fantasy Climbing League. Do you guys want

00:17:16.759 --> 00:17:18.900
to give a brief overview of what that's going

00:17:18.900 --> 00:17:21.960
to be like? How points and scoring work? So,

00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:25.259
I mean, a Fantasy League, if I just give a broad

00:17:25.259 --> 00:17:28.609
idea for people who don't know. um it's kind

00:17:28.609 --> 00:17:31.349
of like a little mini game for different sports

00:17:31.349 --> 00:17:34.670
so if you took it in in soccer you might give

00:17:34.670 --> 00:17:37.190
a little guess for you you can create like a

00:17:37.190 --> 00:17:39.710
team of players and then you can give a guess

00:17:39.710 --> 00:17:43.950
for their scoring in different uh matches so

00:17:43.950 --> 00:17:46.789
in climbing it's it's quite similar um you can

00:17:46.789 --> 00:17:51.079
create a team of different athletes so You have

00:17:51.079 --> 00:17:55.200
a certain amount of credits or virtual money

00:17:55.200 --> 00:17:57.359
to spend on your athletes, and you can create

00:17:57.359 --> 00:17:59.839
a team that you think will do well in the competitions.

00:18:00.140 --> 00:18:03.039
And the scoring is based off of your athletes'

00:18:03.180 --> 00:18:06.220
placements in each World Cup. So, for instance,

00:18:06.339 --> 00:18:10.940
the more high -performing athletes from the previous

00:18:10.940 --> 00:18:14.259
seasons, like Sorato, would cost a lot, so you

00:18:14.259 --> 00:18:17.099
can't have all the best ones in your team. And

00:18:17.099 --> 00:18:19.039
instead, you have to figure out which ones are

00:18:19.039 --> 00:18:21.750
maybe a little bit... cheaper based on their

00:18:21.750 --> 00:18:23.710
previous year, but that you think have evolved

00:18:23.710 --> 00:18:26.750
and will perform this year instead. So in short,

00:18:26.849 --> 00:18:30.009
it's a way to create like some, some idea of

00:18:30.009 --> 00:18:32.289
who you think you will perform at the competitions

00:18:32.289 --> 00:18:34.690
and then, you know, get you hyped up for when

00:18:34.690 --> 00:18:36.750
those climbers are out on the mats. To expand

00:18:36.750 --> 00:18:39.589
a little bit on what Emil said there. So there

00:18:39.589 --> 00:18:43.170
are, there are different ways to kind of like

00:18:43.170 --> 00:18:46.480
create your team within fantasy leagues. Just

00:18:46.480 --> 00:18:49.019
speaking broadly about how people do fantasy

00:18:49.019 --> 00:18:51.339
leagues and other sports, you can also have drafting

00:18:51.339 --> 00:18:55.480
where you get together with friends and one person

00:18:55.480 --> 00:18:59.799
picks an athlete for their team and you go in

00:18:59.799 --> 00:19:03.299
a round -robin way and the next person picks

00:19:03.299 --> 00:19:05.339
and then that athlete just cannot be selected

00:19:05.339 --> 00:19:09.299
twice. That's something that a lot of people

00:19:09.299 --> 00:19:14.390
have requested for fantasy league. which we have

00:19:14.390 --> 00:19:18.049
chosen not to do that now. But if a lot of people

00:19:18.049 --> 00:19:20.730
want it, we'll probably add it for next year.

00:19:21.230 --> 00:19:24.390
And the system that Emil described now is this

00:19:24.390 --> 00:19:27.170
credit -based system. And there is also another

00:19:27.170 --> 00:19:31.130
system in the app that was actually, it was the

00:19:31.130 --> 00:19:34.950
original system where you have athletes divided

00:19:34.950 --> 00:19:38.750
into tiers. So you have like the S tier of the

00:19:38.750 --> 00:19:41.170
top 10 best athletes, and then you have the A

00:19:41.170 --> 00:19:44.230
tier with the next 20 or so, and then everyone

00:19:44.230 --> 00:19:47.130
else is the B tier. And you can choose at most

00:19:47.130 --> 00:19:49.890
two athletes from the A tier and at most two

00:19:49.890 --> 00:19:52.470
from the B tier and so on. And the reason that

00:19:52.470 --> 00:19:57.630
was the original was when we did this the first

00:19:57.630 --> 00:20:00.710
time, it was a couple of friends of ours that

00:20:00.710 --> 00:20:04.369
ran a fantasy league just with an Excel sheet

00:20:04.369 --> 00:20:07.579
a few years ago. Uh, that that's, so this was

00:20:07.579 --> 00:20:11.900
not really our original idea, but they, um, yeah,

00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:13.940
so they just, they just had an Excel sheet and

00:20:13.940 --> 00:20:17.279
it was kind of a lot of work. Um, it was so much

00:20:17.279 --> 00:20:19.240
fun though. And we, we ran it with this tier

00:20:19.240 --> 00:20:21.799
system, which was like, had a lot, it had a lot

00:20:21.799 --> 00:20:25.519
of flaws, obviously. Like if you have one athlete

00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:27.779
that's way better than everyone else, like Yanya,

00:20:27.940 --> 00:20:30.759
then everyone's going to be picking Yanya or

00:20:30.759 --> 00:20:33.720
everyone's going to be picking Serato. But even

00:20:33.720 --> 00:20:38.000
so, it was so much fun. And so that's kind of

00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:42.519
like how this all started. We figured, well,

00:20:42.680 --> 00:20:45.539
why not just make an app that does all the annoying

00:20:45.539 --> 00:20:48.920
stuff for you? And a lot of people, like everyone

00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:54.059
can enjoy it. But yeah, the credit system is

00:20:54.059 --> 00:20:58.230
what we think is probably... the the better system

00:20:58.230 --> 00:21:00.670
out of those two and so that's probably like

00:21:00.670 --> 00:21:02.930
we could have just removed the tier system but

00:21:02.930 --> 00:21:04.829
we figured like this is kind of like a testing

00:21:04.829 --> 00:21:07.769
season and we'll see we'll get feedback see what

00:21:07.769 --> 00:21:11.529
people like and and kind of develop it from there

00:21:11.529 --> 00:21:14.609
cool to learn how it started um so have you guys

00:21:14.609 --> 00:21:17.430
done a lot of other sports fantasy leagues before

00:21:17.430 --> 00:21:21.430
no i think neither of us have any experience

00:21:21.430 --> 00:21:27.170
with that and so Other than that one time we

00:21:27.170 --> 00:21:30.109
did it for climbing, I've been trying to kind

00:21:30.109 --> 00:21:32.150
of like research a bit and like ask other people

00:21:32.150 --> 00:21:34.349
how this is usually done. That's kind of like

00:21:34.349 --> 00:21:37.450
where the credit system came from and also the

00:21:37.450 --> 00:21:39.210
drafting. But the drafting is like, it's a little

00:21:39.210 --> 00:21:42.150
bit annoying to implement and fit into everything

00:21:42.150 --> 00:21:43.950
else. So that's kind of why we skipped that for

00:21:43.950 --> 00:21:48.470
now. And also we think that it will be a lot

00:21:48.470 --> 00:21:51.089
of fun to have kind of like large public leagues.

00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:54.640
with like thousands of people in them and then

00:21:54.640 --> 00:21:58.019
you can't really do drafting. So yeah. I've only

00:21:58.019 --> 00:22:02.240
ever tried like fantasy football one time last

00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:05.799
year. So that's all the experience I have with

00:22:05.799 --> 00:22:07.680
it. And you have this like round Robin draft,

00:22:07.819 --> 00:22:12.400
I guess. But I guess I also wonder with climbing

00:22:12.400 --> 00:22:15.859
specifically, there's not as many athletes who

00:22:15.859 --> 00:22:19.160
you would probably want to pick. So that might

00:22:19.160 --> 00:22:22.740
also have to do with the whole. not drafting

00:22:22.740 --> 00:22:25.019
the same players kind of thing absolutely that's

00:22:25.019 --> 00:22:27.259
also a reason why i thought that drafting might

00:22:27.259 --> 00:22:30.079
not work as well because the pool is just smaller

00:22:30.079 --> 00:22:33.220
if you compare it with like football or yeah

00:22:33.220 --> 00:22:36.640
other sports where you have like hundreds thousands

00:22:36.640 --> 00:22:40.240
of athletes to pick from and the the top level

00:22:40.240 --> 00:22:44.079
is maybe not as uh well you know the the the

00:22:44.079 --> 00:22:49.950
steepness yeah exactly yeah thank you um how

00:22:49.950 --> 00:22:52.289
do you feel like the strategy differs between

00:22:52.289 --> 00:22:56.190
the tier base versus points based drafting yeah

00:22:56.190 --> 00:23:02.009
i mean the it's supposed to be constructed so

00:23:02.009 --> 00:23:06.190
that the athlete credits reflect how many points

00:23:06.190 --> 00:23:09.509
they're expected to gather for your team just

00:23:09.509 --> 00:23:15.390
probabilistically so um you sh like it should

00:23:15.390 --> 00:23:18.410
be like you should be equally your team should

00:23:18.410 --> 00:23:22.930
be equally likely to score well. Um, if you just

00:23:22.930 --> 00:23:27.289
pick a bunch of, uh, maybe lower valued athletes

00:23:27.289 --> 00:23:29.730
as if you picked like four really strong ones.

00:23:30.410 --> 00:23:34.069
So you could, I saw when we, I guess that that

00:23:34.069 --> 00:23:36.049
is not a good representation, but we ran this

00:23:36.049 --> 00:23:39.710
like beta test, um, which was just, it was just

00:23:39.710 --> 00:23:42.029
a copy of the 2025 system. So obviously people

00:23:42.029 --> 00:23:45.039
could just, um, could just look at the results

00:23:45.039 --> 00:23:47.500
if they figured that out. But I did see some

00:23:47.500 --> 00:23:49.960
teams perform really well that only had four

00:23:49.960 --> 00:23:52.319
athletes, which was a surprise to me. I thought,

00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:54.940
because the limit is six, and I thought that

00:23:54.940 --> 00:23:57.180
you would want to have six athletes on your team.

00:23:57.319 --> 00:23:59.839
We haven't really tried the credit system so

00:23:59.839 --> 00:24:03.619
much yet, practically speaking. So it's a little

00:24:03.619 --> 00:24:06.440
bit hard to say. I feel like with the tier lists,

00:24:06.700 --> 00:24:08.799
the big issue is always going to be just the

00:24:08.799 --> 00:24:11.599
fact that there's a lot of top tier athletes.

00:24:12.619 --> 00:24:14.859
they might not be quite equally as good like

00:24:14.859 --> 00:24:16.599
the bottom of the tier to the top of the same

00:24:16.599 --> 00:24:19.339
tier can be a little bit different so it's for

00:24:19.339 --> 00:24:21.680
for bigger leagues it's a little bit more tricky

00:24:21.680 --> 00:24:24.700
to use that system like if we had a thousand

00:24:24.700 --> 00:24:27.359
people who joined one of the fancy leagues uh

00:24:27.359 --> 00:24:29.400
let's say the bouldering season for instance

00:24:29.400 --> 00:24:33.619
um it'd be sort of impossible to get good separation

00:24:33.619 --> 00:24:36.559
with the tier lists i would believe because people

00:24:36.559 --> 00:24:38.240
would pick the same teams but with the credit

00:24:38.240 --> 00:24:41.160
system you really have to dive into what the

00:24:41.160 --> 00:24:42.660
athletes what do you think the athletes can do

00:24:42.660 --> 00:24:45.279
and you can look at for instance the asian championships

00:24:45.279 --> 00:24:47.799
and like oh okay how did these perform oh how

00:24:47.799 --> 00:24:50.779
was it last year okay there these guys are this

00:24:50.779 --> 00:24:53.279
guy is way stronger and she is way stronger and

00:24:53.279 --> 00:24:55.579
then you pick them for your team based off of

00:24:55.579 --> 00:24:58.059
that like based on their improvements as athletes

00:24:58.059 --> 00:25:01.000
which with the credit system i feel like you

00:25:01.000 --> 00:25:03.200
kind of have to dig into the sport a little bit

00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:05.900
deeper so it's kind of more complex in a way

00:25:05.900 --> 00:25:08.900
like it gives the the user a lot more flexibility

00:25:08.900 --> 00:25:13.210
and and you know deep dive into this board i

00:25:13.210 --> 00:25:16.950
think you will see much more like it opens up

00:25:16.950 --> 00:25:19.190
more options and you'll have more kind of like

00:25:19.190 --> 00:25:22.089
dynamic teams whereas like with with a tier based

00:25:22.089 --> 00:25:25.190
system everyone is always going to pick two s

00:25:25.190 --> 00:25:28.430
tier athletes like it would be stupid not to

00:25:28.430 --> 00:25:31.390
and then two b tier a tier athletes and so on

00:25:31.390 --> 00:25:34.690
um but with the credit based system you might

00:25:34.690 --> 00:25:38.609
do really well picking a few lower tiered athletes

00:25:39.769 --> 00:25:42.069
Regarding fantasy leagues and things like that,

00:25:42.150 --> 00:25:45.789
do you have any concerns about the tangentially

00:25:45.789 --> 00:25:51.009
gambling -related aspects of league sports? I

00:25:51.009 --> 00:25:53.589
feel like we've tried to dive into how it could

00:25:53.589 --> 00:25:55.609
become problematic a little bit, because there

00:25:55.609 --> 00:25:57.710
were some people who asked about that, and I

00:25:57.710 --> 00:26:00.690
hadn't really considered that as a thing. Because

00:26:00.690 --> 00:26:05.990
for me, I go into it with a gaming mindset. My

00:26:05.990 --> 00:26:09.750
background is just... being a nerd at things.

00:26:10.089 --> 00:26:14.970
And I would say I'm quite anti -gambling. So

00:26:14.970 --> 00:26:18.549
I really hope there's no way that it could create

00:26:18.549 --> 00:26:22.990
gambling problems. It's definitely something

00:26:22.990 --> 00:26:25.890
to be concerned about, but I feel like that would

00:26:25.890 --> 00:26:28.950
correlate more with the size of the sport. Like

00:26:28.950 --> 00:26:32.750
if climbing grew to be gigantic as a spectating

00:26:32.750 --> 00:26:37.380
sport. then gambling would probably be something

00:26:37.380 --> 00:26:40.480
that starts to happen around it. And I just don't

00:26:40.480 --> 00:26:43.420
feel like a fancy league would be the starting

00:26:43.420 --> 00:26:45.559
point of it necessarily, unless we implemented

00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:47.740
gambling, which we will definitely never do.

00:26:48.079 --> 00:26:50.680
Okay, no plans for that in the future. No way.

00:26:52.279 --> 00:26:56.880
Definitely not. I mean, this is strictly a passion

00:26:56.880 --> 00:27:00.160
project for us. At first we talked about like,

00:27:00.180 --> 00:27:03.369
should we monetize it? Should we not? The only

00:27:03.369 --> 00:27:05.730
thing we discussed is potentially starting up

00:27:05.730 --> 00:27:08.349
like a Patreon where maybe I'll create some content

00:27:08.349 --> 00:27:10.230
throughout competitions or maybe some merch,

00:27:10.430 --> 00:27:14.329
but that would just be to sort of make it sustainable

00:27:14.329 --> 00:27:16.529
in case the fantasy league became like massive

00:27:16.529 --> 00:27:20.990
or something. So it's, I just don't see it being

00:27:20.990 --> 00:27:24.430
a problem for us because we're both against the

00:27:24.430 --> 00:27:28.619
idea of gambling. The worry would be if competitors

00:27:28.619 --> 00:27:31.819
built their own websites and created bigger fancy

00:27:31.819 --> 00:27:34.039
leagues that were competing and then implemented

00:27:34.039 --> 00:27:37.400
betting there, which I can only hope doesn't

00:27:37.400 --> 00:27:40.240
happen. Yeah, I mean, the way it's going to work

00:27:40.240 --> 00:27:43.400
is only admins can create public leagues that

00:27:43.400 --> 00:27:47.359
everyone can join. And then the only thing that

00:27:47.359 --> 00:27:50.519
you can create yourself is just a league that

00:27:50.519 --> 00:27:54.549
you can share with your friends. Yeah, like Emma

00:27:54.549 --> 00:27:57.289
said, we really don't want to promote gambling,

00:27:57.490 --> 00:28:02.910
of course. And so I'm thinking that that's the

00:28:02.910 --> 00:28:08.150
only way that it could kind of turn into a problem

00:28:08.150 --> 00:28:12.190
is if you have a gambling aspect within the public

00:28:12.190 --> 00:28:15.529
leagues that have a broad outreach. But if people

00:28:15.529 --> 00:28:19.250
make a league with their friends and they gamble

00:28:19.250 --> 00:28:22.789
there, within their friend group, it's not necessarily

00:28:22.789 --> 00:28:26.549
a big problem in my mind. I don't exactly know

00:28:26.549 --> 00:28:29.809
how the connection was formed. I guess it's probably

00:28:29.809 --> 00:28:32.890
just that it makes it an easier avenue for you

00:28:32.890 --> 00:28:37.910
to have something to bet on. So you're both very

00:28:37.910 --> 00:28:40.529
anti -gambling and climbing. You don't want that

00:28:40.529 --> 00:28:43.930
to start. Yeah, definitely. There's no way I'd

00:28:43.930 --> 00:28:46.789
want that to start. I don't really... Especially

00:28:46.789 --> 00:28:49.549
that type of public gambling where you... Let's

00:28:49.549 --> 00:28:51.750
say you join a big fancy league and there's like

00:28:51.750 --> 00:28:54.250
a lot of money. If you put in more money yourself,

00:28:54.309 --> 00:28:57.049
for sure, I would be very heavily against that.

00:28:57.490 --> 00:29:01.210
Yeah, I think at one point I really kind of wanted

00:29:01.210 --> 00:29:05.250
to see some more gambling and comp climbing just

00:29:05.250 --> 00:29:07.750
to see what that would do in terms of like engagement

00:29:07.750 --> 00:29:11.650
or like growing the sport or seeing if it would,

00:29:11.670 --> 00:29:15.089
yeah, just like create more hype around the sport

00:29:15.089 --> 00:29:19.160
in general. But. yeah then i guess i learned

00:29:19.160 --> 00:29:22.440
some unsavory information about sports gambling

00:29:22.440 --> 00:29:25.480
and i was like okay maybe not but i'm still a

00:29:25.480 --> 00:29:28.460
little curious like personally what i could say

00:29:28.460 --> 00:29:31.220
like because i guess gambling is kind of a broad

00:29:31.220 --> 00:29:34.420
term um i mean i've thought about i'm i'm sponsored

00:29:34.420 --> 00:29:36.220
by ragni for instance i thought about picking

00:29:36.220 --> 00:29:40.079
out some chalk bags from my stash and like giving

00:29:40.079 --> 00:29:42.339
a few to the top performer in the leagues or

00:29:42.339 --> 00:29:44.680
something like that more or less a fun incentive

00:29:44.680 --> 00:29:47.700
for people and i hope that's not considered gambling

00:29:47.700 --> 00:29:49.720
but i guess it starts to tangent it a little

00:29:49.720 --> 00:29:54.039
bit i just think when you when you well the way

00:29:54.039 --> 00:29:57.180
gambling works in my mind is usually a system

00:29:57.180 --> 00:29:59.579
that sort of forces you to either spend more

00:29:59.579 --> 00:30:02.279
money or like really you know go into it deeper

00:30:02.279 --> 00:30:04.740
and deeper and and that somebody loses a lot

00:30:04.740 --> 00:30:07.059
and somebody wins a lot and that i would like

00:30:07.059 --> 00:30:09.259
to avoid preferably if we have if there was any

00:30:09.259 --> 00:30:11.440
form of thing that could be considered gambling

00:30:11.440 --> 00:30:13.839
it should be a win for everyone involved i guess

00:30:14.509 --> 00:30:17.069
yeah that makes sense because i do agree that

00:30:17.069 --> 00:30:20.089
it i agree that it could create uh some hype

00:30:20.089 --> 00:30:23.029
around it and i mean in a way you're gambling

00:30:23.029 --> 00:30:26.309
your pride if you're on the fantasy website it's

00:30:26.309 --> 00:30:27.789
just like there's no money involved it's not

00:30:27.789 --> 00:30:31.529
the same yeah i guess not but i mean that is

00:30:31.529 --> 00:30:33.750
the the goal is for people to be more engaged

00:30:33.750 --> 00:30:37.970
with the sport and kind of wanna study the competitions

00:30:37.970 --> 00:30:40.170
and the athletes more and like oh who's gonna

00:30:40.170 --> 00:30:42.329
win sort of talk to their friends discuss like

00:30:42.599 --> 00:30:44.460
create more engagement around the sport like

00:30:44.460 --> 00:30:47.380
that is the fundamental goal for the fantasy

00:30:47.380 --> 00:30:51.599
league um but yeah not with gambling i want to

00:30:51.599 --> 00:30:53.740
touch on that also because that's the the season

00:30:53.740 --> 00:30:56.980
that our friends ran this fantasy league it was

00:30:56.980 --> 00:30:59.220
so much more fun to watch the world cups i was

00:30:59.220 --> 00:31:01.720
just at the edge of my seat all the time for

00:31:01.720 --> 00:31:05.200
every comp and that that's kind of what i what

00:31:05.200 --> 00:31:07.640
i want what we want to like bring to the sport

00:31:07.640 --> 00:31:11.000
with this just create a lot more engagement for

00:31:11.000 --> 00:31:13.019
for competition climbing it just makes it much

00:31:13.019 --> 00:31:15.720
more fun to watch and i've also heard other people

00:31:15.720 --> 00:31:19.180
say my i i told my friend about this fantasy

00:31:19.180 --> 00:31:21.039
league and he told his friends that weren't even

00:31:21.039 --> 00:31:22.839
climbers and they said they would be so psyched

00:31:22.839 --> 00:31:25.660
to just to just try this out because and they

00:31:25.660 --> 00:31:27.440
don't even watch competition climbing but this

00:31:27.440 --> 00:31:30.160
would make them interested in watching it and

00:31:30.160 --> 00:31:32.220
that would be that would be really cool Yeah,

00:31:32.220 --> 00:31:34.400
hopefully just putting your pride on the line

00:31:34.400 --> 00:31:38.240
is enough dopamine hit for people. I will say

00:31:38.240 --> 00:31:41.660
though, I did try, what's it called? I tried

00:31:41.660 --> 00:31:43.900
prediction markets because I think sports betting

00:31:43.900 --> 00:31:46.859
isn't legal in California. So I tried a prediction

00:31:46.859 --> 00:31:49.559
market where it's just like, is this football

00:31:49.559 --> 00:31:52.059
team going to win against this other football

00:31:52.059 --> 00:31:53.900
team? And then that's like technically legal

00:31:53.900 --> 00:31:56.819
because you're not placing a bet on a team. You're

00:31:56.819 --> 00:32:00.759
like placing bet on like yes or no. I don't know

00:32:00.759 --> 00:32:03.660
how it works. Interesting. Yeah, but I tried

00:32:03.660 --> 00:32:06.160
it once. And when you put money on the line,

00:32:06.359 --> 00:32:09.140
it's like, it gives you a different rush for

00:32:09.140 --> 00:32:11.420
sure. Yeah, that's for sure the problem. It's

00:32:11.420 --> 00:32:13.119
hard to create that incentive because I think

00:32:13.119 --> 00:32:16.200
in a way it can be kind of a very cool incentive,

00:32:16.359 --> 00:32:19.779
like big number, big dopamine is a good. good

00:32:19.779 --> 00:32:22.339
thing in a way like it it makes it more fun but

00:32:22.339 --> 00:32:24.680
uh it's a tricky balance i guess i mean it is

00:32:24.680 --> 00:32:26.819
it's interesting now now you mention it we actually

00:32:26.819 --> 00:32:29.180
when we did the league we did have money on the

00:32:29.180 --> 00:32:31.880
line we did we did put in like 20 bucks each

00:32:31.880 --> 00:32:34.240
or something but i'd actually i'd actually i

00:32:34.240 --> 00:32:36.400
don't know if that's what made it fun i don't

00:32:36.400 --> 00:32:38.380
think so because i'd i'd actually forgotten about

00:32:38.380 --> 00:32:41.299
it but i i think i think probably people are

00:32:41.299 --> 00:32:44.759
are different there like some people get really

00:32:44.759 --> 00:32:47.839
motivated by by it and some people not i guess

00:32:47.839 --> 00:32:49.990
as long as you're not like promoting it explicitly

00:32:49.990 --> 00:32:52.390
on the website i mean people can choose to do

00:32:52.390 --> 00:32:55.609
what they want with their own leagues um yeah

00:32:55.609 --> 00:32:57.750
i guess like part of the issue that comes with

00:32:57.750 --> 00:33:02.269
it is one thing i heard from i think some comments

00:33:02.269 --> 00:33:04.470
was people were saying that the athletes would

00:33:04.470 --> 00:33:07.809
get a lot of like negative feedback if they performed

00:33:07.809 --> 00:33:11.700
poorly because People were like gambling on them

00:33:11.700 --> 00:33:14.240
and then they performed worse than they expected.

00:33:14.839 --> 00:33:17.039
And then they would get like death threats and

00:33:17.039 --> 00:33:20.480
yeah, crazy stuff happening to them because of

00:33:20.480 --> 00:33:24.940
the high stakes involved. Yeah, that's interesting

00:33:24.940 --> 00:33:26.920
for sure. I wouldn't even have thought of that.

00:33:26.980 --> 00:33:31.039
That's so grim. Yeah, so I thought that was super

00:33:31.039 --> 00:33:33.220
interesting. That kind of helped change my mind

00:33:33.220 --> 00:33:35.759
about why maybe it wouldn't be the best. But,

00:33:35.759 --> 00:33:37.740
you know, do what you want in your personal weeks.

00:33:38.170 --> 00:33:41.289
Okay, so then going into, I guess, what your

00:33:41.289 --> 00:33:45.609
predictions are for the 2026 season. How closely

00:33:45.609 --> 00:33:48.130
are you guys following or like watching the offseason

00:33:48.130 --> 00:33:50.809
training of the athletes? Quite a lot. I've watched

00:33:50.809 --> 00:33:53.450
most of it, I would say. It's like informing

00:33:53.450 --> 00:33:56.710
your predictions for the next season? I definitely

00:33:56.710 --> 00:33:59.210
have some predictions. I have like half my team

00:33:59.210 --> 00:34:02.089
in my head already. Oh, and when does this, when

00:34:02.089 --> 00:34:05.230
does it start? The 2026 season for like, when

00:34:05.230 --> 00:34:08.489
are you opening the climbing leagues? tomorrow

00:34:08.489 --> 00:34:11.750
we're gonna tomorrow yeah yeah yeah because the

00:34:11.750 --> 00:34:15.650
first world cup is on the first of uh yeah first

00:34:15.650 --> 00:34:20.050
of may so quite soon and uh we want to have people

00:34:20.050 --> 00:34:22.429
give people some time to join like the big leagues

00:34:22.429 --> 00:34:25.329
that we're calling them um like the official

00:34:25.329 --> 00:34:27.130
fantasy league where you can compete against

00:34:27.130 --> 00:34:30.309
everyone um so the goal is to launch it all tomorrow

00:34:30.309 --> 00:34:33.880
and and start getting people psyched Well, so

00:34:33.880 --> 00:34:36.159
for reference, this isn't coming out for a week.

00:34:36.260 --> 00:34:38.719
So tomorrow is April 20th. So if you're listening

00:34:38.719 --> 00:34:41.900
to this, it's already, it's open. You can already

00:34:41.900 --> 00:34:46.139
enter. And when does it close? It's supposed

00:34:46.139 --> 00:34:50.980
to close right when it starts. Yeah. You're not

00:34:50.980 --> 00:34:53.639
able to change your team once the event starts.

00:34:53.699 --> 00:34:57.380
That's the idea. Okay. So you guys have to join

00:34:57.380 --> 00:35:01.090
ASAP. Yeah, yeah. The first lead World Cup is

00:35:01.090 --> 00:35:03.309
the week after, and first speed is a week after

00:35:03.309 --> 00:35:06.510
that, I think, roughly at least. So there's some

00:35:06.510 --> 00:35:08.750
time. And then you can, of course, create your

00:35:08.750 --> 00:35:11.829
own leagues with whichever competitions you want

00:35:11.829 --> 00:35:14.989
later in the summer. But hopefully people have

00:35:14.989 --> 00:35:17.010
some time to create their leagues and get involved

00:35:17.010 --> 00:35:20.150
before the first World Cup. Okay, sounds good.

00:35:20.269 --> 00:35:23.550
Everyone get on that. So in terms of your personal

00:35:23.550 --> 00:35:26.989
picks, who do you think are your top picks for

00:35:26.989 --> 00:35:29.679
the season? Please excuse this brief intermission,

00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:31.900
but if you're interested in ad -free episodes

00:35:31.900 --> 00:35:34.239
and would like to unlock over four hours of deleted

00:35:34.239 --> 00:35:36.960
scenes, including one where we talk about the

00:35:36.960 --> 00:35:39.679
climbing scene in Sweden and the possibility

00:35:39.679 --> 00:35:42.780
of different scoring systems, do consider helping

00:35:42.780 --> 00:35:46.119
support this podcast on Patreon. Some other perks

00:35:46.119 --> 00:35:48.179
include a membership pin shipped to you after

00:35:48.179 --> 00:35:51.079
two months, prioritized guest questions, ad -free

00:35:51.079 --> 00:35:54.280
early release episodes, and more to come. The

00:35:54.280 --> 00:35:56.280
proceeds go back into the podcast to help me

00:35:56.280 --> 00:35:58.679
break even, and they help me improve the experience

00:35:58.679 --> 00:36:01.139
of the guests. If you'd like to help out non

00:36:01.139 --> 00:36:03.400
-monetarily, liking, commenting, and sharing

00:36:03.400 --> 00:36:06.079
helps a great deal as well. Back to the show.

00:36:06.340 --> 00:36:08.199
Well, I mean, that's a little bit of a tricky

00:36:08.199 --> 00:36:09.860
thing about this is that there's six categories,

00:36:10.000 --> 00:36:12.739
basically. Right, true. Like men, women, bolder

00:36:12.739 --> 00:36:19.760
lead speed. Top one for each of them. Okay. It's

00:36:19.760 --> 00:36:25.400
a very tricky one this season, I feel like. Because

00:36:25.400 --> 00:36:32.239
I think for bouldering, Sorato and Janja would

00:36:32.239 --> 00:36:37.909
always be my top picks. I guess the same for

00:36:37.909 --> 00:36:40.789
Leeds still. But it's getting closer with a lot

00:36:40.789 --> 00:36:42.750
of people. Like Orianne in Bouldering is crushing

00:36:42.750 --> 00:36:45.969
it and she's really leveled up like an absolute

00:36:45.969 --> 00:36:51.349
beast. And yeah, I really don't know what my

00:36:51.349 --> 00:36:53.369
top picks would be there. For speed climbing,

00:36:53.550 --> 00:36:57.409
I have to admit, I'm painfully uninvolved. I

00:36:57.409 --> 00:36:59.989
think speed climbing is a really cool discipline.

00:37:00.070 --> 00:37:02.429
I tried it for the first time. just a few weeks

00:37:02.429 --> 00:37:05.150
ago actually wow really yeah we don't have a

00:37:05.150 --> 00:37:07.510
speed wall in sweden so i never or we maybe do

00:37:07.510 --> 00:37:09.849
but it's not an official one not with a timer

00:37:09.849 --> 00:37:13.110
stuff like that um so i've never gotten around

00:37:13.110 --> 00:37:15.469
to trying like a proper speed wall going for

00:37:15.469 --> 00:37:17.769
it and i was like damn this is really fun i gotta

00:37:17.769 --> 00:37:20.090
get more involved in in the different athletes

00:37:20.090 --> 00:37:23.889
um like basically all i know is that uh is sam

00:37:23.889 --> 00:37:28.389
watson um and i mean he's been killing it for

00:37:28.389 --> 00:37:35.429
years and i believe Is it Miroslav? That's the

00:37:35.429 --> 00:37:38.389
female top one. I believe she's retiring this

00:37:38.389 --> 00:37:41.849
year. I think so. Yeah. So I really don't know

00:37:41.849 --> 00:37:44.710
for speed at all, to be honest. It's my thing.

00:37:45.309 --> 00:37:47.869
Do we know how many comps Janja is going to go

00:37:47.869 --> 00:37:54.110
to? Not quite yet. I got to check the rate. Maybe

00:37:54.110 --> 00:37:56.769
not the best pick then. Maybe not the best, but

00:37:56.769 --> 00:37:58.969
you can change. So I would pick her when she's

00:37:58.969 --> 00:38:01.269
up. I'm not sure if she's doing the first one,

00:38:01.389 --> 00:38:05.010
actually. i think she is she's signed up for

00:38:05.010 --> 00:38:08.050
it okay yeah i could be wrong i think so same

00:38:08.050 --> 00:38:12.429
picks for you felix um i i also have to admit

00:38:12.429 --> 00:38:16.349
i'm not uh very uh invested in in the speed scene

00:38:16.349 --> 00:38:20.730
i don't know is i know sam watson but is he the

00:38:20.730 --> 00:38:22.789
best actually does he have the world record because

00:38:22.789 --> 00:38:25.809
i i feel like i heard something about an indonesian

00:38:25.809 --> 00:38:28.849
guy or something that that was had the record

00:38:28.849 --> 00:38:33.889
now inofficial i think still okay yeah um but

00:38:33.889 --> 00:38:36.690
i'm looking at the rankings and sam did not get

00:38:36.690 --> 00:38:40.769
first in speed overall last year right yeah oh

00:38:40.769 --> 00:38:43.050
yeah i think it's i think it's yeah he had a

00:38:43.050 --> 00:38:46.230
little bit of a yeah off season i think it was

00:38:46.230 --> 00:38:48.090
like one of the competitions was cancelled for

00:38:48.090 --> 00:38:52.050
him and then he had like a false start or something

00:38:52.050 --> 00:38:55.320
at one of them anyways sorry Yeah, I mean, it

00:38:55.320 --> 00:38:58.480
does seem like the speed, you don't have the

00:38:58.480 --> 00:39:00.380
kind of Janja Sarata phenomenon in the speed.

00:39:00.460 --> 00:39:03.280
The top is quite even. But then I guess there's

00:39:03.280 --> 00:39:05.519
always the, there's kind of an element of chance

00:39:05.519 --> 00:39:08.320
in there as well. Yeah. With false starts and

00:39:08.320 --> 00:39:12.920
stuff. But yeah, I don't know much about the

00:39:12.920 --> 00:39:15.739
speed climbers. And Lida, I actually have not

00:39:15.739 --> 00:39:18.260
been following the precincts so much. I'm much

00:39:18.260 --> 00:39:21.900
more just invested in the bouldering. There I

00:39:21.900 --> 00:39:25.320
have... I think that Max Bertrand will do really

00:39:25.320 --> 00:39:28.739
well. I think, I mean, just watching him in the

00:39:28.739 --> 00:39:31.659
French nationals, he was so good. He was so,

00:39:31.679 --> 00:39:35.360
so good. And it just like, I, I just can't, I

00:39:35.360 --> 00:39:38.980
can really see that his, he could have a trajectory

00:39:38.980 --> 00:39:44.119
that's just like, this goes going. Yeah. I mean,

00:39:44.119 --> 00:39:46.280
cause he's really, he's still really young, right?

00:39:46.340 --> 00:39:49.800
It's like 16, 17 or something. And so it's kind

00:39:49.800 --> 00:39:52.519
of at an age where you can make a lot of improvements.

00:39:52.699 --> 00:39:54.920
It happens for a lot of athletes around that

00:39:54.920 --> 00:39:58.659
age. And I think this year he's going to do fantastically.

00:39:59.300 --> 00:40:00.940
Yeah, I don't know if I've mentioned this yet,

00:40:00.960 --> 00:40:03.599
but the video that I'm releasing this with is

00:40:03.599 --> 00:40:06.860
with Max, me and Max training here in ARCO together,

00:40:07.039 --> 00:40:12.179
actually. And he's a beast. I love Max. Yeah,

00:40:12.199 --> 00:40:17.199
he also seems like he has a fantastic mentality

00:40:17.199 --> 00:40:20.889
in comps. He seems so relaxed. It doesn't seem

00:40:20.889 --> 00:40:23.889
like the pressure gets to him at all. I mean,

00:40:23.929 --> 00:40:26.909
it seems that way. I don't know. And at that

00:40:26.909 --> 00:40:31.610
age, that's really cool to see. Besides Max,

00:40:31.909 --> 00:40:35.849
I think Doyun will do really well. I mean, he

00:40:35.849 --> 00:40:38.630
always does well. So he's very consistent. But

00:40:38.630 --> 00:40:41.590
then in the Asian Championships, he killed it.

00:40:41.710 --> 00:40:44.530
He was so good. Wait, I haven't watched it yet.

00:40:44.670 --> 00:40:46.989
Crap. I was supposed to watch that before. No,

00:40:47.110 --> 00:40:49.400
I mean, it's fine. It's fine. Yeah, okay. I'm

00:40:49.400 --> 00:40:52.500
not going to give anything else away from that

00:40:52.500 --> 00:40:54.760
then. But I do have another... Wait, did something

00:40:54.760 --> 00:40:59.579
crazy happen? I would say so. It's okay, just

00:40:59.579 --> 00:41:03.880
say it. Is it okay? I think Imori is going to

00:41:03.880 --> 00:41:07.099
crush it on the women's side. She's improved

00:41:07.099 --> 00:41:10.000
a lot, it seems at least, on the styles that

00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:14.239
she used to struggle on. Just become a beast

00:41:14.239 --> 00:41:16.679
at bouldering. Enough that you would pick her?

00:41:17.119 --> 00:41:19.059
I might pick her for bouldering, yeah. I think

00:41:19.059 --> 00:41:22.480
I would, yeah. She was really good. There was

00:41:22.480 --> 00:41:25.639
this Chinese guy, also at the Asian Championship,

00:41:25.940 --> 00:41:29.820
that I had never heard of. I think it was Jungse

00:41:29.820 --> 00:41:34.059
Hu, probably butchered his name, but he did really

00:41:34.059 --> 00:41:38.920
well. And he's valued at very low credits, so

00:41:38.920 --> 00:41:40.780
I think he will do really well for his value.

00:41:41.539 --> 00:41:44.219
It's an insider pick. I mean, it could be super

00:41:44.219 --> 00:41:47.570
awful, so no one knows. but yeah after your video

00:41:47.570 --> 00:41:50.329
with um max would you put him on your team or

00:41:50.329 --> 00:41:53.489
no oh max is going on my team regardless of how

00:41:53.489 --> 00:41:55.289
he does he's going to be top picked every time

00:41:55.289 --> 00:41:58.090
like he's a good friend of mine i've known him

00:41:58.090 --> 00:42:01.269
since he was like 14 and he burnt me off on a

00:42:01.269 --> 00:42:04.889
boulder in font so we have a i use i i cannot

00:42:04.889 --> 00:42:07.510
cheer for him more than anyone else like he's

00:42:07.510 --> 00:42:11.510
he's the best Okay, I'll keep these in mind.

00:42:12.110 --> 00:42:14.630
What about kind of like comebacks from injury?

00:42:14.789 --> 00:42:18.449
There were some big ones last year. I think ones

00:42:18.449 --> 00:42:21.710
that come to mind are Toby and Natalia. Yeah,

00:42:21.769 --> 00:42:25.789
I think Toby's really interesting. His sort of,

00:42:25.789 --> 00:42:28.769
I guess he was still injured at the time, but

00:42:28.769 --> 00:42:32.670
I mean, his... Was it between Innsbruck and the

00:42:32.670 --> 00:42:36.469
World Cup before that he jumped like 51 placements

00:42:36.469 --> 00:42:39.309
or something? I mean, he's kind of a wild card,

00:42:39.389 --> 00:42:42.670
to be honest. And I think he's figured out a

00:42:42.670 --> 00:42:46.230
lot of injuries. And I mean, he's for sure one

00:42:46.230 --> 00:42:49.750
to look out for in the coming season. I think

00:42:49.750 --> 00:42:51.869
injuries are tricky because you don't know if

00:42:51.869 --> 00:42:53.010
they're going to flare up or if they're going

00:42:53.010 --> 00:42:54.769
to be a problem. So it's like kind of a risk

00:42:54.769 --> 00:42:57.889
to... to invest in the previously injured athletes

00:42:57.889 --> 00:43:00.469
but they always make comebacks and crush it so

00:43:00.469 --> 00:43:04.489
natalia has also done like a crazy comeback she

00:43:04.489 --> 00:43:08.010
was at the bouldering nationals she won in the

00:43:08.010 --> 00:43:10.590
u .s yeah yeah i think so yeah which is just

00:43:10.590 --> 00:43:13.889
like crazy after so many so many injuries um

00:43:13.889 --> 00:43:17.590
so i'm i mean i'm i'm hoping for a comeback and

00:43:17.590 --> 00:43:19.949
i wouldn't be surprised to see one um yeah no

00:43:19.949 --> 00:43:23.449
with toby it's it's hard to know like um i watched

00:43:23.449 --> 00:43:26.730
a lot of his youtube videos uh and he's talked

00:43:26.730 --> 00:43:29.030
a lot openly on social media right about like

00:43:29.030 --> 00:43:31.130
his competition performance and how it dropped

00:43:31.130 --> 00:43:33.889
off a lot after the olympics but i don't really

00:43:33.889 --> 00:43:36.230
like i don't know if it's uh was it a mental

00:43:36.230 --> 00:43:38.949
thing or was it because he had all his injuries

00:43:38.949 --> 00:43:41.469
like he had this like a nerve thing or was it

00:43:41.469 --> 00:43:47.289
with the um with the shoulder right um and so

00:43:47.289 --> 00:43:50.670
i mean if it was just an injury that he was uh

00:43:50.670 --> 00:43:53.489
struggling with maybe he's gonna do amazingly

00:43:53.489 --> 00:43:57.510
this season if that's all healed up. Yeah, I

00:43:57.510 --> 00:43:59.530
feel like it was probably mostly the injury.

00:44:00.010 --> 00:44:02.909
Yeah, and then also with Fantasy League, he'd

00:44:02.909 --> 00:44:05.050
probably be valued pretty low since he didn't

00:44:05.050 --> 00:44:06.929
score so well last season, so he could be a great

00:44:06.929 --> 00:44:10.730
pick. Yeah. I don't know. But what would be your

00:44:10.730 --> 00:44:16.170
picks? Well, I didn't have this insider information,

00:44:16.449 --> 00:44:18.889
so now I kind of feel like I need to steal from

00:44:18.889 --> 00:44:24.340
that. I don't know speed super well. either um

00:44:24.340 --> 00:44:27.340
i have kind of had like the feeling that zach

00:44:27.340 --> 00:44:29.659
hammer was starting to do super well in speed

00:44:29.659 --> 00:44:33.739
um like the other american speed climber um but

00:44:33.739 --> 00:44:35.900
i just looked and he's already number three so

00:44:35.900 --> 00:44:38.739
i don't feel like it's like how much better can

00:44:38.739 --> 00:44:41.460
you get there so i don't know maybe not the best

00:44:41.460 --> 00:44:46.099
maybe not the best pick um for boulder and lead

00:44:46.099 --> 00:44:49.639
i actually also haven't followed lead as closely

00:44:49.639 --> 00:44:53.679
um i've watched a bit more boulder but yeah i

00:44:53.679 --> 00:44:56.519
was thinking that the injured athletes could

00:44:56.519 --> 00:44:59.219
have could be a good pick toby and natalia could

00:44:59.219 --> 00:45:03.420
be good picks um max is also rated pretty low

00:45:03.420 --> 00:45:07.480
so that could be a good pick he seems like he's

00:45:07.480 --> 00:45:10.679
doing pretty well he also i guess had an injury

00:45:10.679 --> 00:45:13.659
with his foot but not during the season yeah

00:45:13.659 --> 00:45:17.360
no he's doing well he's doing well is there anyone

00:45:17.360 --> 00:45:19.820
that you think will experience a downfall this

00:45:19.820 --> 00:45:22.880
season Stay away from. Damn, I don't know if

00:45:22.880 --> 00:45:26.239
I can. Can I say that? Are people going to stab

00:45:26.239 --> 00:45:30.980
me? Well, if you have insider information. A

00:45:30.980 --> 00:45:36.320
downfall. I don't know. I mean, it depends on

00:45:36.320 --> 00:45:39.019
how you mean a downfall. I think people are progressing

00:45:39.019 --> 00:45:41.739
at a pretty astounding rate and learning different

00:45:41.739 --> 00:45:45.099
styles. So I think in a way, Janja could see

00:45:45.099 --> 00:45:48.500
a downfall. Like she might play second a few

00:45:48.500 --> 00:45:51.280
times in comps instead of just dominating every

00:45:51.280 --> 00:45:53.360
single one. I don't think that will be the case,

00:45:53.400 --> 00:45:55.380
but I think it's more likely this year than any

00:45:55.380 --> 00:45:58.820
other year. Just because people are getting more

00:45:58.820 --> 00:46:00.719
and more dominant and they're sort of like...

00:46:01.259 --> 00:46:03.780
it's more of a question if she's going to dominate

00:46:03.780 --> 00:46:06.079
every single comp now than I feel it used to

00:46:06.079 --> 00:46:09.199
be like four years ago, whatever. And I mean,

00:46:09.199 --> 00:46:12.119
Janja has not gotten worse. Like she is an absolute

00:46:12.119 --> 00:46:14.679
beast still, but I do think the rest are sort

00:46:14.679 --> 00:46:18.699
of catching up in a way or at least like, yeah,

00:46:18.760 --> 00:46:20.960
learning new skills that can really challenge

00:46:20.960 --> 00:46:24.840
her. So that would be my hot take in terms of

00:46:24.840 --> 00:46:27.699
downfall. But I don't think we're going to see.

00:46:28.440 --> 00:46:31.159
like i don't know of any particular you know

00:46:31.159 --> 00:46:33.500
somebody who used to place in the top three getting

00:46:33.500 --> 00:46:35.579
to like a 20th placement all the time really

00:46:35.579 --> 00:46:38.320
no i was i had the exact same thought i think

00:46:38.320 --> 00:46:42.019
maybe the the yanya gap has maybe evened out

00:46:42.019 --> 00:46:44.139
a little bit i would think but then at the same

00:46:44.139 --> 00:46:48.400
time she was at the pcl and crushed it there

00:46:48.400 --> 00:46:52.059
did lose but but kind of not necessarily because

00:46:52.059 --> 00:46:56.199
she wasn't strong enough um But I still do think

00:46:56.199 --> 00:47:00.179
that, yeah, she, like, Oriane and Aimori, I think,

00:47:00.179 --> 00:47:03.539
could give her a run for the money. Really? I

00:47:03.539 --> 00:47:08.019
think so. Like, for sure, she could lose now.

00:47:08.679 --> 00:47:11.199
I really got to watch Asian Championships because

00:47:11.199 --> 00:47:13.260
it sounds like something crazy happened there.

00:47:13.599 --> 00:47:17.440
I hate to spoil it, but, like, I don't know because

00:47:17.440 --> 00:47:20.820
Aimori crushed it in the finals. She, like, absolutely

00:47:20.820 --> 00:47:23.239
destroyed everything. But then I think she...

00:47:23.449 --> 00:47:25.809
didn't qualify very high into the final and i

00:47:25.809 --> 00:47:27.929
didn't watch the qualification round or semi

00:47:27.929 --> 00:47:30.829
-final or whatever so maybe she does have some

00:47:30.829 --> 00:47:32.869
weaknesses there i don't know or it was just

00:47:32.869 --> 00:47:34.670
a flash comp and everyone did everything and

00:47:34.670 --> 00:47:36.789
she kind of just like yeah had a fewer attempts

00:47:36.789 --> 00:47:40.309
or something i think the tricky bit about you

00:47:40.309 --> 00:47:43.750
know betting on i is that like if it's within

00:47:43.750 --> 00:47:47.110
her framework as a climber she like can always

00:47:47.110 --> 00:47:50.409
win basically she's freakishly strong and can

00:47:50.409 --> 00:47:53.230
do so so many things in climbing but as soon

00:47:53.230 --> 00:47:55.630
as it's out of her box like she's just completely

00:47:55.630 --> 00:47:58.449
shut down whereas someone like yanya would compensate

00:47:58.449 --> 00:48:01.070
like if it's not yanya's style whatever that

00:48:01.070 --> 00:48:04.170
would be she will still find a way to do it but

00:48:04.170 --> 00:48:07.690
i don't think i would necessarily do that i that

00:48:07.690 --> 00:48:11.170
that's kind of what i thought also before that

00:48:11.170 --> 00:48:14.409
i has i is kind of not as well rounded as a lot

00:48:14.409 --> 00:48:16.230
of the others like she would struggle with certain

00:48:16.230 --> 00:48:19.960
moves But she seems to have gotten a lot better

00:48:19.960 --> 00:48:24.239
at those things now. I think maybe Yanya's weakness

00:48:24.239 --> 00:48:27.960
would be if it turns into kind of a flash round.

00:48:28.820 --> 00:48:32.199
It seems like she isn't as able to flash things.

00:48:32.360 --> 00:48:34.880
Or maybe just if they're easier, she just doesn't

00:48:34.880 --> 00:48:37.000
have as much interest in it. So she kind of just

00:48:37.000 --> 00:48:39.980
goes through it and maybe makes some mistakes.

00:48:41.699 --> 00:48:45.559
I think Oriane has always... kind of been on

00:48:45.559 --> 00:48:50.760
her tail but then whenever there's a long strengthy

00:48:50.760 --> 00:48:54.320
power indurancy route she just kind of gases

00:48:54.320 --> 00:48:57.920
out and then it's not gonna happen unless she

00:48:57.920 --> 00:49:00.980
flashes it yeah but she has such good tactics

00:49:00.980 --> 00:49:05.280
nowadays like she orianne is always giving two

00:49:05.280 --> 00:49:08.000
attempts on the like really powerful long climbs

00:49:08.000 --> 00:49:12.800
and she's like super strategic about it um And

00:49:12.800 --> 00:49:15.940
I think, I mean, setting will always be a big

00:49:15.940 --> 00:49:18.980
part of the comps. I kind of hope they do set

00:49:18.980 --> 00:49:21.039
a lot harder than they have in the previous,

00:49:21.219 --> 00:49:26.099
I guess, years. I often feel like the women's

00:49:26.099 --> 00:49:30.260
sets can be a bit, well, it's kind of like Janja

00:49:30.260 --> 00:49:31.739
always says, she feels that they're too easy

00:49:31.739 --> 00:49:33.699
and they look too easy as well. Like it's so

00:49:33.699 --> 00:49:37.079
often that you see flash rounds or like... I

00:49:37.079 --> 00:49:39.179
don't know. And I don't personally enjoy that

00:49:39.179 --> 00:49:40.780
so much. I think it's way more interesting to

00:49:40.780 --> 00:49:42.880
watch a comp where you have somebody who, like

00:49:42.880 --> 00:49:45.880
one person getting three tops is almost perfect

00:49:45.880 --> 00:49:48.239
for me. And one boulder just being almost impossible.

00:49:48.480 --> 00:49:50.440
That's fine. As long as you can see some progression

00:49:50.440 --> 00:49:52.679
or see somebody like make a zone or show that

00:49:52.679 --> 00:49:55.400
it's maybe possible. Like that's for me when

00:49:55.400 --> 00:49:57.980
I enjoy them the most. But I always think of

00:49:57.980 --> 00:49:59.980
it as like if two climbers flashes a boulder,

00:50:00.119 --> 00:50:03.639
that boulder is almost useless for the comp in

00:50:03.639 --> 00:50:06.199
a way. because you're just like you well the

00:50:06.199 --> 00:50:08.860
thing is like you're getting the same it's it's

00:50:08.860 --> 00:50:11.860
way more um like prominent in lead climbing but

00:50:11.860 --> 00:50:13.800
you're basically getting the same score but you're

00:50:13.800 --> 00:50:16.599
not putting out the same performance necessarily

00:50:16.599 --> 00:50:19.019
like obviously that's the only way we can value

00:50:19.019 --> 00:50:23.420
it in in the sport but i just don't i just don't

00:50:23.420 --> 00:50:25.780
see that boulder being equally as valuable as

00:50:25.780 --> 00:50:27.659
a boulder that's caused some level of separation

00:50:27.659 --> 00:50:32.500
um so yeah i mean and it for the women it's not

00:50:32.500 --> 00:50:34.900
that uncommon that you see several flashes on

00:50:34.900 --> 00:50:37.400
a boulder and so it's like well where's the separation

00:50:37.400 --> 00:50:39.559
like could just two attempts would have been

00:50:39.559 --> 00:50:41.619
good to have or something and and i would like

00:50:41.619 --> 00:50:44.099
to see more of that uh because then i think we

00:50:44.099 --> 00:50:47.139
can get like a more clear answer to how dominant

00:50:47.139 --> 00:50:50.199
janja is for instance um you know if people are

00:50:50.199 --> 00:50:52.539
on their tail because everybody can mess up a

00:50:52.539 --> 00:50:54.599
flash like there's not a climber in the world

00:50:54.599 --> 00:50:58.260
who you know doesn't stumble from time to time

00:50:58.809 --> 00:51:00.610
And it gives very little information to whether

00:51:00.610 --> 00:51:02.869
or not they are like stronger or not or better

00:51:02.869 --> 00:51:05.469
or not. Because it's really like after five to

00:51:05.469 --> 00:51:07.210
10 attempts on a boulder that you get to see

00:51:07.210 --> 00:51:09.750
the full picture or let's say three to 10 attempts

00:51:09.750 --> 00:51:11.630
on a boulder. You get to see the full picture

00:51:11.630 --> 00:51:13.730
of how somebody can perform on that. And the

00:51:13.730 --> 00:51:16.489
flash go is more like, you know, it's obviously

00:51:16.489 --> 00:51:18.929
great to perform on a flash, but I don't think

00:51:18.929 --> 00:51:21.010
it's as interesting as the second, third or fourth

00:51:21.010 --> 00:51:23.210
attempt. Yeah, I think that's why she asked for

00:51:23.210 --> 00:51:26.000
harder rounds because. I think still at this

00:51:26.000 --> 00:51:29.719
moment, if it was a harder round, I think she

00:51:29.719 --> 00:51:34.079
would still be pulling away. I remember, I forget

00:51:34.079 --> 00:51:36.679
which exact hump it was, but there was one towards

00:51:36.679 --> 00:51:40.119
the end of the season last year. I think Oriane

00:51:40.119 --> 00:51:43.699
was kind of set to win if she had completed the

00:51:43.699 --> 00:51:46.280
boulder, if she had topped the boulder. And then,

00:51:46.340 --> 00:51:49.139
yeah, it was like, yeah, she powered out in the

00:51:49.139 --> 00:51:52.030
end. Yeah, I think it was the championships where

00:51:52.030 --> 00:51:56.449
she and Meshti placed second, both. Yeah, I know

00:51:56.449 --> 00:51:59.989
what you mean. I mean, that definitely does happen.

00:52:00.090 --> 00:52:03.150
But I think Oriana's leveled up even more this

00:52:03.150 --> 00:52:05.969
year. I think, like, she's a high bet for me.

00:52:06.010 --> 00:52:08.150
I think she's going to crush it. And she's, like,

00:52:08.170 --> 00:52:11.030
she has the mentality. She's psyched. Yeah, it'll

00:52:11.030 --> 00:52:13.349
be fun. Felix, any other thoughts there? I guess

00:52:13.349 --> 00:52:15.130
it is kind of a hard question because you don't

00:52:15.130 --> 00:52:18.010
want to prey on anyone's downfall. And you never

00:52:18.010 --> 00:52:20.179
know who's going to get injured. Yeah, exactly.

00:52:20.440 --> 00:52:24.179
No, I don't really like, I also can't think of

00:52:24.179 --> 00:52:26.380
any of the top athletes that have leveled down.

00:52:26.460 --> 00:52:28.139
It feels like if anything, everyone's just kind

00:52:28.139 --> 00:52:30.800
of gotten better. So I don't know, since I haven't

00:52:30.800 --> 00:52:32.519
watched Asian championships yet. I don't know.

00:52:32.760 --> 00:52:36.719
I was thinking maybe for downfall. I wonder if

00:52:36.719 --> 00:52:39.719
Tomo will have a harder time this year. He's

00:52:39.719 --> 00:52:43.019
just got a lot going on, you know, with the kid

00:52:43.019 --> 00:52:44.900
and everything. I feel like that's not easy.

00:52:47.579 --> 00:52:49.699
Because it has to come at some point, right?

00:52:49.780 --> 00:52:51.940
Like he's been at the top, like been so good

00:52:51.940 --> 00:52:54.179
for so long. At some point, it has to trend downwards.

00:52:54.820 --> 00:52:59.960
I actually just spent a week with Katsu and Tsukuru,

00:53:00.099 --> 00:53:03.719
who set at B -Pump. And I don't think Timo is

00:53:03.719 --> 00:53:06.199
going to see a downfall this year. But I don't

00:53:06.199 --> 00:53:07.780
know. I don't know. It's just the way they were

00:53:07.780 --> 00:53:10.000
talking about it. I'm like, okay, he's probably

00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:12.900
going to do all right. It sounds like he's still

00:53:12.900 --> 00:53:15.739
very much at the cutting edge of the dynamic

00:53:15.739 --> 00:53:19.400
stuff. So, and it's such a huge part of competitions

00:53:19.400 --> 00:53:22.239
to really have that dialed. And he's so far advanced

00:53:22.239 --> 00:53:24.840
that it's hard for people to catch up with that

00:53:24.840 --> 00:53:27.579
style. So I feel like it would be if they stopped

00:53:27.579 --> 00:53:29.420
setting dynamic stuff, maybe tomorrow I could

00:53:29.420 --> 00:53:31.559
see a downfall, but I don't really see that happening.

00:53:31.800 --> 00:53:33.920
Well, people say that they're like moving towards

00:53:33.920 --> 00:53:37.460
more old school, hard pulling, tiny holds or

00:53:37.460 --> 00:53:40.179
whatever. I don't know how true that'll be. I

00:53:40.179 --> 00:53:42.989
think that'll never happen. I think there's a

00:53:42.989 --> 00:53:46.510
good example of it. They had a straightforward

00:53:46.510 --> 00:53:49.809
pulling downward boulder. I think it was in Salt

00:53:49.809 --> 00:53:52.570
Lake City 2024 or something that everyone was

00:53:52.570 --> 00:53:54.630
sort of hyping as like, oh, it's a power boulder.

00:53:54.710 --> 00:53:56.849
Finally, we get something like this again. And

00:53:56.849 --> 00:54:00.789
I looked at it, and I'm pretty sure most at the

00:54:00.789 --> 00:54:03.070
top level wouldn't consider that a straightforward

00:54:03.070 --> 00:54:05.849
pulling boulder. It was basically campusing on

00:54:05.849 --> 00:54:08.750
jugs. in a tricky fashion that looks like straightforward

00:54:08.750 --> 00:54:11.090
pulling. But the way straightforward pulling

00:54:11.090 --> 00:54:14.489
really sort of challenges you kind of requires

00:54:14.489 --> 00:54:17.070
this board style climbing where if you cut feet,

00:54:17.210 --> 00:54:18.929
you're screwed because otherwise it's just going

00:54:18.929 --> 00:54:22.949
to be like moving dynamically on jugs. So I think

00:54:22.949 --> 00:54:24.710
there's still a little bit off from getting that

00:54:24.710 --> 00:54:27.269
straightforward pulling back in action. I don't

00:54:27.269 --> 00:54:29.929
think it's on the radar quite yet. And so you

00:54:29.929 --> 00:54:32.170
think like the tricky looks like straightforward

00:54:32.170 --> 00:54:34.309
bouldering, but isn't, he would still crush.

00:54:34.909 --> 00:54:39.170
yeah yeah that's all just like yeah i i i don't

00:54:39.170 --> 00:54:41.349
think we've seen that in a quite some time i

00:54:41.349 --> 00:54:43.210
think the last like straightforward power boulder

00:54:43.210 --> 00:54:48.590
i saw was a semi -final in brixen 2023 uh where

00:54:48.590 --> 00:54:51.670
yannick's like sweeped around and aside from

00:54:51.670 --> 00:54:54.130
that there's almost nothing that i would categorize

00:54:54.130 --> 00:54:57.030
as that level like obviously there's less more

00:54:57.030 --> 00:54:59.969
or less of that style but where it's kind of

00:54:59.969 --> 00:55:01.730
like the biggest requirements i don't think there

00:55:01.730 --> 00:55:03.510
was a single bowler last season that i thought

00:55:03.510 --> 00:55:05.750
was like okay this is really challenging their

00:55:05.750 --> 00:55:10.030
old school style because the thing is when it's

00:55:10.030 --> 00:55:12.130
not that you can always compensate with dynamic

00:55:12.130 --> 00:55:14.329
skill and sort of momentum and that kind of stuff

00:55:14.329 --> 00:55:15.869
like if the hold is good enough for the athletes

00:55:15.869 --> 00:55:18.690
to hold on then they're just going to move dynamically

00:55:18.690 --> 00:55:22.829
and like yeah figure it out in modern ways do

00:55:22.829 --> 00:55:26.500
you think it would be interesting to watch like

00:55:26.500 --> 00:55:29.760
straightforward hard pulling for not like people

00:55:29.760 --> 00:55:32.840
who aren't like super hard climbers oh i mean

00:55:32.840 --> 00:55:34.920
i have a lot of hot takes about that kind of

00:55:34.920 --> 00:55:37.119
thing because i'm not a huge fan of how they

00:55:37.119 --> 00:55:40.139
film climbing and how they sort of really look

00:55:40.139 --> 00:55:44.199
into the perspective for the audience i think

00:55:44.199 --> 00:55:46.739
straightforward pulling always comes down to

00:55:46.739 --> 00:55:50.400
communicating like why it's hard uh and you sort

00:55:50.400 --> 00:55:54.010
of have to show the separation with the athletes

00:55:54.010 --> 00:55:56.550
when you do that which is really really difficult

00:55:56.550 --> 00:55:59.530
um i think it can look incredibly interesting

00:55:59.530 --> 00:56:02.210
for a non -climber if you can visually understand

00:56:02.210 --> 00:56:05.329
like why the holds are as bad as they are and

00:56:05.329 --> 00:56:08.050
it's usually not enough to just like have a close

00:56:08.050 --> 00:56:11.010
-up because close -up of hand of a hand on a

00:56:11.010 --> 00:56:13.389
hold looks the same on like a 20 millimeter edge

00:56:13.389 --> 00:56:16.250
as a six millimeter edge almost unless it's like

00:56:16.250 --> 00:56:19.889
the time when the hand lands on the like when

00:56:19.889 --> 00:56:21.750
the hand lands on the hole then you can see a

00:56:21.750 --> 00:56:23.630
little bit of a difference but it's really hard

00:56:23.630 --> 00:56:27.070
to show that difference visually um and i think

00:56:27.070 --> 00:56:29.929
they would need to learn quite a lot about that

00:56:29.929 --> 00:56:32.090
the the filming crew i'm not gonna say i could

00:56:32.090 --> 00:56:35.030
do it but i just i i there's i'm sure a lot of

00:56:35.030 --> 00:56:37.230
cinematographers that could help them out with

00:56:37.230 --> 00:56:39.630
it that's all i'm saying to really showcase that

00:56:39.630 --> 00:56:44.469
style in a better way well how would you do it

00:56:44.469 --> 00:56:49.429
um In a competition. Do you do it? Do you feel

00:56:49.429 --> 00:56:51.750
like you do it in your videos? Not so much anymore

00:56:51.750 --> 00:56:53.949
because it takes a lot of quite a lot of work

00:56:53.949 --> 00:56:56.829
to do it properly. And for me, it's also very

00:56:56.829 --> 00:56:58.409
different because it's way easier to explain

00:56:58.409 --> 00:57:00.630
things in a word that I'm doing. Like, oh, I'm

00:57:00.630 --> 00:57:02.550
going to grab this edge. It's the size of a credit

00:57:02.550 --> 00:57:04.590
card. Like that's kind of enough to understand

00:57:04.590 --> 00:57:09.750
what it is. I would assume graphics could help

00:57:09.750 --> 00:57:14.789
a lot. Sort of potentially showing. the hold

00:57:14.789 --> 00:57:16.969
in relative terms to what people have in their

00:57:16.969 --> 00:57:18.829
in their household i don't know stuff like that

00:57:18.829 --> 00:57:21.710
could be enough um it is a tricky question though

00:57:21.710 --> 00:57:27.690
um because you you do like when you show if you

00:57:27.690 --> 00:57:29.170
show something like that you're also taken away

00:57:29.170 --> 00:57:30.550
from something else like they have to make a

00:57:30.550 --> 00:57:33.670
decision with what they're showing um and sometimes

00:57:33.670 --> 00:57:37.090
i feel like that decision isn't quite right the

00:57:37.090 --> 00:57:39.730
competitions you know they're they're often showing

00:57:39.730 --> 00:57:43.010
like somebody's foot on a hold when somebody

00:57:43.010 --> 00:57:44.710
else is topping a boulder in the semifinals.

00:57:44.929 --> 00:57:47.650
So I do think they have some other work to focus

00:57:47.650 --> 00:57:51.170
on first, rather than how to showcase a straightforward

00:57:51.170 --> 00:57:53.750
pulling boulder. But I do think it could be interesting

00:57:53.750 --> 00:57:57.210
if done like perfect. But I definitely see that

00:57:57.210 --> 00:57:59.449
it's trickier than like a massive five meter

00:57:59.449 --> 00:58:01.409
paddle dino. Like that looks pretty spectacular

00:58:01.409 --> 00:58:04.510
the second you see it. And I don't remember like

00:58:04.510 --> 00:58:09.329
this Salt Lake. boulder 2024 but i feel like

00:58:09.329 --> 00:58:11.489
it's the worst if it's it looks straightforward

00:58:11.489 --> 00:58:14.030
and it looks like it's jugs but it just happens

00:58:14.030 --> 00:58:16.150
to be hard in some way that seems like the worst

00:58:16.150 --> 00:58:20.469
option i don't know if i 100 agree that the reason

00:58:20.469 --> 00:58:22.869
it's not interesting to show hard pulling is

00:58:22.869 --> 00:58:25.530
because it kind of doesn't look spectacular it

00:58:25.530 --> 00:58:27.829
looks easy because i think that's kind of just

00:58:27.829 --> 00:58:30.750
uh that's kind of like i don't know why but like

00:58:30.750 --> 00:58:33.230
fundamentally it just kind of looks always looks

00:58:33.230 --> 00:58:36.400
easier than it is also with this like coordination

00:58:36.400 --> 00:58:40.519
dynos. Just like if I see a video of coordination

00:58:40.519 --> 00:58:43.960
dyno in the gym at home, it can look easy and

00:58:43.960 --> 00:58:46.719
then I go and try it and it's super hard. And

00:58:46.719 --> 00:58:49.360
it goes just kind of for all climbing, I think.

00:58:49.880 --> 00:58:52.679
But I think in general with that style, the biggest

00:58:52.679 --> 00:58:56.460
problem will always be for the setters. I mean,

00:58:56.480 --> 00:59:00.000
setting hard, crimpy or pinchy or slopey boulders

00:59:00.000 --> 00:59:01.880
in that way, that's just straightforward pulling.

00:59:02.650 --> 00:59:05.010
You have to sort of take perfectly into account

00:59:05.010 --> 00:59:07.550
the conditions of that specific day if you want

00:59:07.550 --> 00:59:09.349
to make it hard enough to create good separation.

00:59:10.610 --> 00:59:13.269
I think they are definitely fully capable to

00:59:13.269 --> 00:59:15.530
do that, like to create really, really cool separation

00:59:15.530 --> 00:59:18.349
between the athletes by setting like harder crimp

00:59:18.349 --> 00:59:20.849
lines. But there is a high chance that if they

00:59:20.849 --> 00:59:23.150
do push the limit a little bit too much and then

00:59:23.150 --> 00:59:24.650
it's just a little bit too warm on the day of

00:59:24.650 --> 00:59:26.750
the comp, then nobody gets like a single move

00:59:26.750 --> 00:59:30.530
on it. I do think there is a solution. I think

00:59:30.530 --> 00:59:32.909
they could set boulders to be gradually harder

00:59:32.909 --> 00:59:36.769
than they do nowadays. For me, that was sort

00:59:36.769 --> 00:59:38.909
of a tricky thing about the PCL, for instance,

00:59:39.070 --> 00:59:41.070
where I thought that it looked like they set

00:59:41.070 --> 00:59:42.929
moves that were very even and they looked like

00:59:42.929 --> 00:59:45.130
really cool boulders. But I think the format

00:59:45.130 --> 00:59:47.909
would have done better if each move was slightly

00:59:47.909 --> 00:59:50.329
harder than the previous one. And I do believe

00:59:50.329 --> 00:59:54.630
the same goes for World Cups. often that it's

00:59:54.630 --> 00:59:56.550
fine if the first couple of moves are done by

00:59:56.550 --> 00:59:58.550
a lot of people, but then it's just like the

00:59:58.550 --> 01:00:00.849
last three moves are just impossible aside from

01:00:00.849 --> 01:00:04.349
for a few specific top end athletes at that style.

01:00:04.530 --> 01:00:06.670
I think that would be really cool to see personally.

01:00:07.050 --> 01:00:09.349
Going back real quick to the very initial question

01:00:09.349 --> 01:00:12.010
of maybe if Tomoa will have a downfall. What

01:00:12.010 --> 01:00:16.230
about Tomoa versus Meiji? I talked to somebody

01:00:16.230 --> 01:00:18.289
about that just a few hours ago. Yeah, I talked

01:00:18.289 --> 01:00:22.659
to Stefano about that. Because basically, the

01:00:22.659 --> 01:00:25.960
thing is, we discussed, have they ever been on

01:00:25.960 --> 01:00:27.800
the podium at the same time together, Tomoa and

01:00:27.800 --> 01:00:31.599
Meiji? And I'm not sure that they have. And the

01:00:31.599 --> 01:00:34.119
reason is probably because if a round suits Meiji,

01:00:34.260 --> 01:00:36.400
it's not going to suit Tomoa. Because they are

01:00:36.400 --> 01:00:38.820
like a 20 centimeter difference in height and

01:00:38.820 --> 01:00:44.320
reach and style. So with them, I think as a versus,

01:00:44.360 --> 01:00:46.480
for sure, it's like just depending on the round.

01:00:46.809 --> 01:00:48.389
Like just depending on the style. Because I think

01:00:48.389 --> 01:00:51.070
they're like incredibly good at very separate

01:00:51.070 --> 01:00:53.849
things. Yeah, that's interesting. Do you guys

01:00:53.849 --> 01:00:56.130
feel like you have very different climbing abilities?

01:00:56.429 --> 01:00:58.949
I think we have basically the same style, right?

01:00:59.030 --> 01:01:02.869
Yeah, very similar, I would say. Yeah, I think

01:01:02.869 --> 01:01:05.750
it's the height just that makes such a huge difference

01:01:05.750 --> 01:01:08.769
for them being like that far apart. But style

01:01:08.769 --> 01:01:10.530
-wise, they're quite similar, wouldn't you say?

01:01:10.630 --> 01:01:14.159
Or I guess maybe to more wise is... I guess,

01:01:14.179 --> 01:01:15.860
known for being really good at the coordination

01:01:15.860 --> 01:01:18.760
stuff. And Meiji, I don't know if he's necessarily

01:01:18.760 --> 01:01:22.639
known for that, but he's still kind of like,

01:01:22.639 --> 01:01:25.300
most of the Japanese I would say are pretty well

01:01:25.300 --> 01:01:28.460
-rounded and he's also quite well -rounded. Yeah,

01:01:28.500 --> 01:01:31.559
he doesn't have anything that stands out about

01:01:31.559 --> 01:01:36.619
him, but he's just kind of like, good. He's here

01:01:36.619 --> 01:01:40.900
today. Yeah, I definitely agree. Yeah. I think

01:01:40.900 --> 01:01:42.920
he's probably built out from a lot of comps.

01:01:42.940 --> 01:01:47.840
That is sort of an issue, I feel, with the top

01:01:47.840 --> 01:01:50.920
-end performers of the sport, is that because

01:01:50.920 --> 01:01:54.099
the setting matters so, so much, there's a huge...

01:01:54.099 --> 01:01:56.460
If we're talking about the guys now, at least,

01:01:56.579 --> 01:02:00.380
the height will be around 170, 175 for a lot

01:02:00.380 --> 01:02:02.340
of the top -end athletes. The setting's also

01:02:02.340 --> 01:02:05.360
more dense at that height. It's sort of adapted

01:02:05.360 --> 01:02:07.139
for that, and you'll have outliers performing

01:02:07.139 --> 01:02:10.400
here and there. But I do think, I mean, Meiji

01:02:10.400 --> 01:02:13.340
is like very, very tall. He's going to be built

01:02:13.340 --> 01:02:17.320
out of so many boxes and so many moves. I think

01:02:17.320 --> 01:02:19.500
when you adapt a move to work for the shorter

01:02:19.500 --> 01:02:22.239
climbers, you usually either make it breakable

01:02:22.239 --> 01:02:24.320
for the taller climbers or you make it hard,

01:02:24.380 --> 01:02:26.059
like way harder for the taller climbers because

01:02:26.059 --> 01:02:28.300
you have so many like bigger leverages to work

01:02:28.300 --> 01:02:32.920
with. So yeah, it's always tricky. I wonder how

01:02:32.920 --> 01:02:35.639
he got so much taller than Tomoe. I've never

01:02:35.639 --> 01:02:38.539
seen such a difference between like... siblings

01:02:38.539 --> 01:02:41.820
of the same gender super strange okay cool so

01:02:41.820 --> 01:02:44.539
then let's get into some of the audience questions

01:02:44.539 --> 01:02:47.599
um the first one i think most related to this

01:02:47.599 --> 01:02:50.940
is from xander .com what style of comp climbing

01:02:50.940 --> 01:02:53.860
would change the results the most this is okay

01:02:53.860 --> 01:02:56.460
so this is going to be a bit of a i have a i

01:02:56.460 --> 01:03:00.389
i don't think a climbing style is like Aside

01:03:00.389 --> 01:03:02.329
from just saying pure straightforward pulling

01:03:02.329 --> 01:03:04.250
would change the results tremendously, I actually

01:03:04.250 --> 01:03:07.309
think the hold usage would change the results

01:03:07.309 --> 01:03:10.630
the most. I think using more wooden holds or

01:03:10.630 --> 01:03:15.130
the no -texture transparent holds, that would

01:03:15.130 --> 01:03:18.530
change the results tremendously. That's my belief.

01:03:18.909 --> 01:03:22.570
That's one of the big separators is skin. And

01:03:22.570 --> 01:03:25.010
that you can see a big change in athletes when

01:03:25.010 --> 01:03:27.489
they have good skin for the specific hold selection.

01:03:28.199 --> 01:03:29.900
You can really see that sort of shine through,

01:03:30.000 --> 01:03:32.179
which if you switch out the holds a lot, you'll

01:03:32.179 --> 01:03:34.000
see different performances, especially if people

01:03:34.000 --> 01:03:35.980
aren't that used to it, which wooden holds would

01:03:35.980 --> 01:03:39.039
be the case with. Yeah. Do they ever use like

01:03:39.039 --> 01:03:43.820
those really like crappy textureless old boulder

01:03:43.820 --> 01:03:47.880
holds during the World Cups? Not yet. No, not

01:03:47.880 --> 01:03:50.679
quite. Are you talking about the kind of like

01:03:50.679 --> 01:03:54.230
see -through glass ones? Like, not no -techs,

01:03:54.230 --> 01:03:56.969
but just, like, old crappy holds that have been

01:03:56.969 --> 01:03:59.449
in use for so long that they are, like, worse

01:03:59.449 --> 01:04:01.730
than dual -techs, basically. I guess they're

01:04:01.730 --> 01:04:03.849
just not fun to look at. They're not. I hate

01:04:03.849 --> 01:04:07.070
them. That could change some things. I think,

01:04:07.070 --> 01:04:10.909
honestly, the top competition climbers are so

01:04:10.909 --> 01:04:12.909
good at everything. They're so well -rounded.

01:04:12.949 --> 01:04:15.590
It's kind of hard to come up with a style that

01:04:15.590 --> 01:04:17.889
would separate them. I think Emil is right with

01:04:17.889 --> 01:04:20.150
the, like, climbing on no -techs is such a weird

01:04:20.150 --> 01:04:23.070
thing where, like, I think some people are just

01:04:23.070 --> 01:04:25.650
naturally better at it. They just have the skin

01:04:25.650 --> 01:04:28.510
for it. I mean, obviously you could come up with

01:04:28.510 --> 01:04:30.429
some kind of non -serious answers. Like if they

01:04:30.429 --> 01:04:32.650
added a bunch of crack climbing, I think some

01:04:32.650 --> 01:04:36.050
people would struggle a lot. But outside of that,

01:04:36.150 --> 01:04:38.889
I think it's kind of like, they're all so well

01:04:38.889 --> 01:04:41.750
-rounded. What if it was just like all slab climbing?

01:04:42.230 --> 01:04:46.500
I don't know. I think it's... They would change

01:04:46.500 --> 01:04:49.380
things naturally. You'd see some people, like

01:04:49.380 --> 01:04:53.360
Yannick, he would not have a good time. He doesn't

01:04:53.360 --> 01:05:00.320
seem to have a good time anyway. But I think...

01:05:00.320 --> 01:05:03.519
I don't know about slabs, because in general,

01:05:03.739 --> 01:05:06.579
everyone's so good at slabs that it feels almost

01:05:06.579 --> 01:05:09.380
like... It's definitely not a coin toss, but

01:05:09.380 --> 01:05:11.380
it's like you'll have some people performing

01:05:11.380 --> 01:05:13.039
on a slab at one comp and then somebody else

01:05:13.039 --> 01:05:14.679
performing on the next one. And it doesn't feel

01:05:14.679 --> 01:05:17.539
like... You know, there's a huge pile of athletes

01:05:17.539 --> 01:05:19.840
who are just like crazy slab climbers that don't

01:05:19.840 --> 01:05:21.579
perform on the other styles as well. I would

01:05:21.579 --> 01:05:25.440
say I think slab is already really high represented

01:05:25.440 --> 01:05:28.380
in the comps. One style that is not represented

01:05:28.380 --> 01:05:31.880
is just like this kind of long endurance climbs

01:05:31.880 --> 01:05:36.139
that you mainly see outdoors. Like I'm talking

01:05:36.139 --> 01:05:40.010
like a 15 move or 20 move boulder. it's just

01:05:40.010 --> 01:05:42.250
not it just doesn't work in a comp so that's

01:05:42.250 --> 01:05:44.070
obviously like there are reasons why not to set

01:05:44.070 --> 01:05:45.949
it but that i think would separate cause a lot

01:05:45.949 --> 01:05:47.949
of separation like lead climbers would do better

01:05:47.949 --> 01:05:50.849
just why do you think that wouldn't work in competitions

01:05:50.849 --> 01:05:55.929
well it's uh if you have a 20 20 move boulder

01:05:55.929 --> 01:05:58.610
you kind of just have one attempt like you're

01:05:58.610 --> 01:06:02.670
just gonna do one attempt and then rest for two

01:06:02.670 --> 01:06:06.010
minutes and give one attempt that's not gonna

01:06:06.010 --> 01:06:08.679
lead anywhere really that's the same for seven

01:06:08.679 --> 01:06:11.300
move power boulders though like generally speaking

01:06:11.300 --> 01:06:13.179
you shouldn't give more than two attempts like

01:06:13.179 --> 01:06:15.719
most coaches i believe would say that that if

01:06:15.719 --> 01:06:18.380
you're in a round uh and unless you have like

01:06:18.380 --> 01:06:21.739
some ungodly and like recovery rates and you're

01:06:21.739 --> 01:06:24.539
very good at you know working with that then

01:06:24.539 --> 01:06:26.519
most climbers shouldn't be giving more than two

01:06:26.519 --> 01:06:29.400
attempts on the more powerful climbs yeah but

01:06:29.400 --> 01:06:31.039
two attempts is fine it creates a lot of suspense

01:06:31.039 --> 01:06:34.539
for the second attempt uh you see someone getting

01:06:34.539 --> 01:06:36.619
like i don't know pretty close to the top and

01:06:36.619 --> 01:06:38.000
they rest for two minutes and they're like okay

01:06:38.000 --> 01:06:40.480
now it's it like it really matters and they at

01:06:40.480 --> 01:06:43.599
least have a chance but if if you do like if

01:06:43.599 --> 01:06:45.539
you're on the wall for like two minutes on a

01:06:45.539 --> 01:06:48.260
pure endurance route and you come down like it's

01:06:48.260 --> 01:06:51.719
gonna be over there is no way and secondly i

01:06:51.719 --> 01:06:53.920
think i think it's just like it's kind of hard

01:06:53.920 --> 01:06:57.079
maybe it is possible but it feels like with the

01:06:57.079 --> 01:06:59.559
with the walls that you have it's kind of hard

01:06:59.559 --> 01:07:01.579
to do like you would have to set like a roof

01:07:02.159 --> 01:07:05.960
Or something. And it's hard to film. Yeah wall

01:07:05.960 --> 01:07:07.800
space would be hard. They would have to like

01:07:07.800 --> 01:07:10.760
snake it around. And then it's like a little

01:07:10.760 --> 01:07:12.760
convoluted maybe. True. But it would be interesting

01:07:12.760 --> 01:07:15.360
to see I think. I love that style. Because you

01:07:15.360 --> 01:07:17.840
get such a good fight. Get some mics on that.

01:07:18.059 --> 01:07:20.659
That would be glorious. But then isn't that too

01:07:20.659 --> 01:07:23.739
much like lead? no i think i mean because it

01:07:23.739 --> 01:07:25.440
depends on how long we're talking about i do

01:07:25.440 --> 01:07:27.000
think if the climbers ended up being on the world

01:07:27.000 --> 01:07:29.380
for two minutes on a power endurance climb then

01:07:29.380 --> 01:07:31.739
you have a lot of good rests on that power climb

01:07:31.739 --> 01:07:33.880
and maybe that's not the style i would want i

01:07:33.880 --> 01:07:35.139
would say like you should be on the wall for

01:07:35.139 --> 01:07:37.480
maybe a minute for a power climb in like a steep

01:07:37.480 --> 01:07:41.260
terrain like that um generally when people are

01:07:41.260 --> 01:07:42.800
on the wall for that long it's like you find

01:07:42.800 --> 01:07:45.239
a no hands rest in a corner or something or know

01:07:45.239 --> 01:07:47.659
you're resting on a jug i feel like in if we're

01:07:47.659 --> 01:07:49.460
talking about long power endurance climbs it

01:07:49.460 --> 01:07:51.119
shouldn't be that you're able to rest in the

01:07:51.119 --> 01:07:53.340
positions maybe you can chalk up at one spot

01:07:53.340 --> 01:07:56.880
but then like keep going would be my idea um

01:07:56.880 --> 01:07:59.820
and i think that would be super interesting to

01:07:59.820 --> 01:08:02.880
see i don't i don't know especially in like a

01:08:02.880 --> 01:08:05.619
semi -final where it doesn't really matter if

01:08:05.619 --> 01:08:08.079
you're just on the mats like looking at the boulder

01:08:08.079 --> 01:08:10.760
and then giving one attempt could be a really

01:08:10.760 --> 01:08:13.239
great addition something that that kind of challenges

01:08:13.239 --> 01:08:15.400
the something that challenges the pump to some

01:08:15.400 --> 01:08:18.659
degree because even the longer bowlers right

01:08:18.659 --> 01:08:20.420
now feels like it's it's not going to be that

01:08:20.420 --> 01:08:22.659
you you get to the top and you're pumped so much

01:08:22.659 --> 01:08:24.579
i don't know maybe i'm wrong maybe they do get

01:08:24.579 --> 01:08:26.920
pumped but it feels like it's more it's it's

01:08:26.920 --> 01:08:30.319
very pure power that like uh yeah more like a

01:08:30.319 --> 01:08:32.760
pure power endurance test usually but i agree

01:08:32.760 --> 01:08:34.439
like it shouldn't be too long it shouldn't be

01:08:34.439 --> 01:08:36.760
too adjacent to lead climbing because then i

01:08:36.760 --> 01:08:38.850
mean you already have lead climbing so so i guess

01:08:38.850 --> 01:08:41.229
what's the difference between what you're describing

01:08:41.229 --> 01:08:44.810
and what the like existing power boulders are

01:08:44.810 --> 01:08:48.470
well for one big thing i would say is the the

01:08:48.470 --> 01:08:51.409
angle change like for this for a long power endurance

01:08:51.409 --> 01:08:53.869
climb to be interesting you also want a steep

01:08:53.869 --> 01:08:56.390
wall because otherwise the moves are just gonna

01:08:56.390 --> 01:08:59.390
well probably not work so well like if you have

01:08:59.390 --> 01:09:01.829
a 30 degree wall your biggest limiting factor

01:09:01.829 --> 01:09:05.369
is usually like friction on the whole than being

01:09:05.369 --> 01:09:07.829
able to sort of balance on it. But when you have

01:09:07.829 --> 01:09:09.850
like a 70 degree wall, it's your full body power

01:09:09.850 --> 01:09:12.590
that can work with it. And 70 degree walls don't

01:09:12.590 --> 01:09:14.750
really exist at many of the competition venues,

01:09:14.949 --> 01:09:18.090
if any, even nowadays. So I think that would

01:09:18.090 --> 01:09:22.149
be a big like separator of the styles in a way.

01:09:22.329 --> 01:09:24.369
Because if you made it like long and traversing,

01:09:24.369 --> 01:09:26.670
I think you end up with like resting positions

01:09:26.670 --> 01:09:29.810
that are more relaxed than you could have in

01:09:29.810 --> 01:09:33.109
like a steeper 50, 60, 70 degree roof. and and

01:09:33.109 --> 01:09:36.090
also a lot of the power boulders nowadays they

01:09:36.090 --> 01:09:38.250
have more cruxes rather than just being like

01:09:38.250 --> 01:09:41.430
purely being able to sustain the energy output

01:09:41.430 --> 01:09:43.529
you know what i mean that's how i feel at least

01:09:43.529 --> 01:09:46.189
yeah i would agree just uh the wall angle i feel

01:09:46.189 --> 01:09:48.310
like roof climbing is quite underrepresented

01:09:48.310 --> 01:09:51.850
in in competition and just compared to like how

01:09:51.850 --> 01:09:54.489
it is represented in commercial climbing and

01:09:54.489 --> 01:09:58.430
outside outdoor climbing it's it's uh it's yeah

01:09:58.430 --> 01:10:01.119
you very rarely see that at competitions yeah

01:10:01.119 --> 01:10:03.479
i wonder if that's like a filming issue absolutely

01:10:03.479 --> 01:10:05.899
it could be it's got to be right yeah or even

01:10:05.899 --> 01:10:08.659
if you're like in the audience like i feel like

01:10:08.659 --> 01:10:11.319
it would be kind of hard to see if you're not

01:10:11.319 --> 01:10:14.260
right up against the mats yeah i mean i think

01:10:14.260 --> 01:10:17.100
i think that's largely the reason for a lot of

01:10:17.100 --> 01:10:19.539
the decisions on like what styles to represent

01:10:19.539 --> 01:10:21.720
in competition is like how well they do on camera

01:10:21.720 --> 01:10:23.699
how interesting it is to watch that that's kind

01:10:23.699 --> 01:10:25.810
of what dictates it the most i think Well, going

01:10:25.810 --> 01:10:28.430
into the next audience question from Lucky Penguin

01:10:28.430 --> 01:10:31.189
3, what do you think the future of comp climbing

01:10:31.189 --> 01:10:34.430
will look like? I think for me, I wouldn't consider

01:10:34.430 --> 01:10:36.930
too much of like the moves and the styles that's

01:10:36.930 --> 01:10:38.909
going to change. I'm just very curious about

01:10:38.909 --> 01:10:42.310
how the sport and how we consume it will differ.

01:10:42.569 --> 01:10:45.350
Because it's still like climbing is kind of a

01:10:45.350 --> 01:10:48.810
huge sport from my perception, at least. Like

01:10:48.810 --> 01:10:50.810
it seems like there's a lot of gyms opening up.

01:10:50.850 --> 01:10:52.789
It's booming everywhere. Everybody knows somebody

01:10:52.789 --> 01:10:58.119
who climbs. i would be surprised if competition

01:10:58.119 --> 01:11:00.800
climbing couldn't expand a lot more in viewership

01:11:00.800 --> 01:11:02.979
i'm not gonna be the one to say how i think the

01:11:02.979 --> 01:11:05.899
pcl is like an extremely great attempt at it

01:11:05.899 --> 01:11:08.720
and an interesting take on it but i feel like

01:11:08.720 --> 01:11:10.180
there's got to be a lot of different ways that

01:11:10.180 --> 01:11:12.840
competition climbing will evolve over the years

01:11:12.840 --> 01:11:18.390
um and that's gonna be interesting to see to

01:11:18.390 --> 01:11:20.670
me because i mean they have changed the format

01:11:20.670 --> 01:11:22.810
i don't know how many times since i started climbing

01:11:22.810 --> 01:11:26.409
like from zones to bonuses to points to i don't

01:11:26.409 --> 01:11:30.750
know what um and and all those things for me

01:11:30.750 --> 01:11:34.350
uh affect the experience like tremendously um

01:11:34.350 --> 01:11:36.810
i mean i for instance love the point system but

01:11:36.810 --> 01:11:40.010
it does also sort of create a different type

01:11:40.010 --> 01:11:42.250
of separation than we had before and i think

01:11:42.250 --> 01:11:45.359
when i started tops were worth so much more than

01:11:45.359 --> 01:11:48.380
zones that you almost didn't care about a zone

01:11:48.380 --> 01:11:50.960
anyways those things like the rules have changed

01:11:50.960 --> 01:11:52.359
so so much and i feel like that's what's going

01:11:52.359 --> 01:11:55.680
to change competition climbing more than necessarily

01:11:55.680 --> 01:11:58.159
the setting or the style because that's just

01:11:58.159 --> 01:12:00.260
going to be trends going up and back like back

01:12:00.260 --> 01:12:02.439
and forth i think over the years but yeah again

01:12:02.439 --> 01:12:06.600
i i couldn't dive into like what would be better

01:12:06.600 --> 01:12:08.539
or different um but i just feel like there's

01:12:08.539 --> 01:12:10.600
so many ways you can experience competition climbing

01:12:10.600 --> 01:12:12.689
and i've Do you think that's going to change

01:12:12.689 --> 01:12:14.569
a lot over the years? I don't think it will change

01:12:14.569 --> 01:12:17.649
that much. It has kind of followed the same direction

01:12:17.649 --> 01:12:20.130
over the years. And I don't think I mean, it's

01:12:20.130 --> 01:12:24.189
always changed a lot since like 2011 or so. But

01:12:24.189 --> 01:12:25.869
in the past five years, it's kind of like it's

01:12:25.869 --> 01:12:28.329
been about the same. They've maybe shifted the

01:12:28.329 --> 01:12:31.510
ratios a bit on like what styles are more and

01:12:31.510 --> 01:12:33.229
more or less common. And there are like I said,

01:12:33.390 --> 01:12:35.050
there are like trends, but I don't think we'll

01:12:35.050 --> 01:12:37.949
ever go back to this this like power climbs of.

01:12:38.390 --> 01:12:43.130
of 2010 or whatever. I do think that competition

01:12:43.130 --> 01:12:46.489
climbing will continue to grow a lot. I feel

01:12:46.489 --> 01:12:50.970
like it's still growing and it has become so

01:12:50.970 --> 01:12:55.829
much bigger a part of the sport than it was when

01:12:55.829 --> 01:12:59.270
I started. I feel like when I started, at least

01:12:59.270 --> 01:13:00.930
in Sweden, it felt that way. I don't know if

01:13:00.930 --> 01:13:03.029
it felt that way in other parts of the world,

01:13:03.050 --> 01:13:05.250
but outdoor climbing felt like it was the thing.

01:13:05.789 --> 01:13:11.010
And competition climbing was something that some

01:13:11.010 --> 01:13:14.050
people did, but it was a small part of the sport.

01:13:14.189 --> 01:13:16.430
And now it feels like it's the main part of the

01:13:16.430 --> 01:13:20.130
sport for a lot of people. It's at least a really

01:13:20.130 --> 01:13:22.310
big part of it. And I think that will continue,

01:13:22.890 --> 01:13:26.010
that direction will continue and competition

01:13:26.010 --> 01:13:30.170
climbing will just become more exclusive. And

01:13:30.170 --> 01:13:34.529
I think the top end will will rise a lot. I think

01:13:34.529 --> 01:13:37.909
the sport is still quite small and we will continue

01:13:37.909 --> 01:13:42.350
to see many examples of Janjas and Cerrados come

01:13:42.350 --> 01:13:47.470
out. Okay, next one from Pad Sarma. What expectations

01:13:47.470 --> 01:13:50.050
should a beginner have at a comp? What were your

01:13:50.050 --> 01:13:53.529
first ones like? Well, for me, my first comps

01:13:53.529 --> 01:13:56.390
were like, those were almost the best, to be

01:13:56.390 --> 01:14:01.729
honest. Yeah, I just had like... always had a

01:14:01.729 --> 01:14:05.529
some level of a smile on my face or like a really

01:14:05.529 --> 01:14:08.430
cool experience because what i what i like to

01:14:08.430 --> 01:14:11.329
view comps as is you get to have like these perfectly

01:14:11.329 --> 01:14:13.550
curated boulders and you get to have a session

01:14:13.550 --> 01:14:16.270
on them where you can talk to your friends like

01:14:16.270 --> 01:14:18.729
really analyze everything afterwards and and

01:14:18.729 --> 01:14:22.069
i mean depending on which comp you enter it's

01:14:22.069 --> 01:14:24.850
just going to be perfect boulders for you to

01:14:24.850 --> 01:14:28.239
enjoy in most cases like probably suited to your

01:14:28.239 --> 01:14:30.260
style depending or not your style but your level

01:14:30.260 --> 01:14:32.239
depending on what level of the comp you're entering

01:14:32.239 --> 01:14:35.100
and even if they're not you just get to try some

01:14:35.100 --> 01:14:36.819
really really cool moves that you definitely

01:14:36.819 --> 01:14:39.840
wouldn't get to experience in many other scenarios

01:14:39.840 --> 01:14:42.899
because it's rare that gyms can fit that like

01:14:42.899 --> 01:14:46.359
style and the aesthetics of a climb in a wall

01:14:46.359 --> 01:14:48.720
without having to sacrifice a lot of other wall

01:14:48.720 --> 01:14:51.939
space so i mean you just have this like one beautiful

01:14:51.939 --> 01:14:54.060
art piece that somebody put out for you to enjoy

01:14:54.569 --> 01:14:57.449
so just soak that in enjoy the experience though

01:14:57.449 --> 01:15:00.350
those are my thoughts on like especially the

01:15:00.350 --> 01:15:03.489
first couple of comps you can do then as you

01:15:03.489 --> 01:15:06.489
progress i mean it can you know you have performance

01:15:06.489 --> 01:15:08.750
that start to dictate and you know all these

01:15:08.750 --> 01:15:11.529
things but in the beginning it's just such a

01:15:11.529 --> 01:15:14.189
beautiful thing yeah absolutely just try to have

01:15:14.189 --> 01:15:16.909
fun i mean at the end of the day unless you're

01:15:16.909 --> 01:15:19.470
a professional climber climbing is just a hobby

01:15:19.470 --> 01:15:22.289
it's just something you do for fun so and try

01:15:22.289 --> 01:15:25.029
not to get too much in your head when things

01:15:25.029 --> 01:15:27.810
don't go your way like maybe you fall off the

01:15:27.810 --> 01:15:30.529
last move of the bow of the first boulder with

01:15:30.529 --> 01:15:34.430
like five seconds left or whatever just forget

01:15:34.430 --> 01:15:37.689
about it and move on and just yeah but especially

01:15:37.689 --> 01:15:40.609
just try to have fun because often like if you

01:15:40.609 --> 01:15:44.590
if you get in your head and you kind of aren't

01:15:44.590 --> 01:15:46.630
having fun you probably won't perform as well

01:15:46.630 --> 01:15:50.600
either easier said than done absolutely you said

01:15:50.600 --> 01:15:52.920
that you felt like uh like the mental aspect

01:15:52.920 --> 01:15:55.760
wasn't a hard part for you when you tried competing

01:15:55.760 --> 01:15:59.939
so do you have any like tips there uh did you

01:15:59.939 --> 01:16:02.100
have something emin you can go ahead i can formulate

01:16:02.100 --> 01:16:05.920
my thoughts a little bit i i i've uh because

01:16:05.920 --> 01:16:08.000
it's not like i have uh i've struggled a lot

01:16:08.000 --> 01:16:10.939
with competitions in both good ways and bad ways

01:16:10.939 --> 01:16:14.720
in terms of the mental headspace you're in um

01:16:14.720 --> 01:16:20.029
but i i personally find that it like once you

01:16:20.029 --> 01:16:24.310
start to overthink it it's very easy to get sucked

01:16:24.310 --> 01:16:26.090
into those thoughts deeper and deeper and deeper

01:16:26.090 --> 01:16:28.250
and the best way for me to experience competition

01:16:28.250 --> 01:16:31.369
climbing is to just really view it as like a

01:16:31.369 --> 01:16:34.930
an experience um and as i mentioned just having

01:16:34.930 --> 01:16:38.930
these beautiful dogs to get on um so yeah i feel

01:16:38.930 --> 01:16:41.529
like for me mentally that helps the most to really

01:16:41.529 --> 01:16:43.869
not focus on what the performance part of it

01:16:43.869 --> 01:16:46.520
is and just focus on how epic it is to get to

01:16:46.520 --> 01:16:50.859
climb on on these things yeah i i think i do

01:16:50.859 --> 01:16:55.760
a lot of the same um i do get nervous before

01:16:55.760 --> 01:16:59.359
it comes like i think that's that's not necessarily

01:16:59.359 --> 01:17:04.619
a bad thing but i tend to when i get out on the

01:17:04.619 --> 01:17:07.960
mats like for one thing i think i tend to be

01:17:07.960 --> 01:17:11.619
like overly positive which can be good like i

01:17:11.619 --> 01:17:14.460
always think like oh I'm gonna go out and it's

01:17:14.460 --> 01:17:18.119
gonna go so well and that's kind of just that's

01:17:18.119 --> 01:17:22.920
just kind of how I think um which I think can

01:17:22.920 --> 01:17:27.140
help and uh then I don't know when I get out

01:17:27.140 --> 01:17:30.840
on on the mats I get really just kind of focused

01:17:30.840 --> 01:17:34.659
on the climbing what happens if you say oh it's

01:17:34.659 --> 01:17:37.560
gonna go well and it doesn't go well yeah but

01:17:37.560 --> 01:17:41.600
then like Let's say it goes poorly the first

01:17:41.600 --> 01:17:43.539
boulder. Then I think, well, maybe no one did

01:17:43.539 --> 01:17:45.159
that boulder. Maybe it was just really hard.

01:17:45.260 --> 01:17:47.939
And maybe I can make it through if I do the next

01:17:47.939 --> 01:17:50.739
boulder. And then that doesn't go well. And then,

01:17:50.760 --> 01:17:55.779
I mean, often I'm wrong. Often I don't do that

01:17:55.779 --> 01:17:57.500
boulder and it turns out everyone else did it.

01:17:57.600 --> 01:18:01.159
But in the moment, in the comp, I'm thinking

01:18:01.159 --> 01:18:04.359
like, well, no, but that was so hard. Like, probably

01:18:04.359 --> 01:18:09.229
no one did it. And I think it helps. And then

01:18:09.229 --> 01:18:12.930
last one from Montgomery's. What's your favorite...

01:18:12.930 --> 01:18:18.609
Wait, hold on. World of Warcraft raid slash dungeon.

01:18:18.930 --> 01:18:21.890
I was like, wait, what is WOW again? I know this

01:18:21.890 --> 01:18:26.789
one. Okay. That's a niche question if I ever

01:18:26.789 --> 01:18:29.090
heard one. Yeah, we could talk for hours about

01:18:29.090 --> 01:18:32.189
this. Yeah, that's a whole separate podcast,

01:18:32.550 --> 01:18:35.050
I would say. Is it a niche question? A lot of

01:18:35.050 --> 01:18:37.149
people play that. Yeah, yeah, but it's quite

01:18:37.149 --> 01:18:39.130
separate from competition climbing. Oh, yeah,

01:18:39.170 --> 01:18:41.189
yeah. You know what I mean? So in that way, niched.

01:18:41.670 --> 01:18:44.569
Niched in the sense that people who listen to

01:18:44.569 --> 01:18:46.649
this podcast most likely might not be like, oh,

01:18:46.670 --> 01:18:48.789
yeah, I have to know this. Well, for the interest,

01:18:49.050 --> 01:18:54.109
BWL. Felix? Oh, man. Zulgarub, maybe. There we

01:18:54.109 --> 01:18:57.010
go. If I spent 10 minutes, I would come up with

01:18:57.010 --> 01:18:58.949
a different answer. Wait, what was it called?

01:18:59.789 --> 01:19:02.760
Zulgarub. For those who know. I'm sure they'll

01:19:02.760 --> 01:19:04.800
be very interested in that. If you know, you

01:19:04.800 --> 01:19:07.840
know. Yeah. Okay, cool. Well, I think that's

01:19:07.840 --> 01:19:09.739
all the questions I had for today then. Thanks

01:19:09.739 --> 01:19:11.859
for joining. And of course, I will leave the

01:19:11.859 --> 01:19:14.520
link to the Fantasy Climbing League below. Make

01:19:14.520 --> 01:19:16.800
sure to join as soon as possible because it will

01:19:16.800 --> 01:19:19.239
close, I think, probably in like a week after

01:19:19.239 --> 01:19:21.220
this comes out. Practically, yeah, I guess so.

01:19:21.500 --> 01:19:24.779
Yeah, like three, four days, I think. Yeah, for

01:19:24.779 --> 01:19:26.300
the bouldering. But then we have lead and speed

01:19:26.300 --> 01:19:28.960
still rolling. Okay, so you'll be able to join

01:19:28.960 --> 01:19:33.489
those like... week or so before that starts up

01:19:33.489 --> 01:19:36.750
yeah i mean i would say like if if it turns out

01:19:36.750 --> 01:19:39.229
a lot of people miss it we can always start another

01:19:39.229 --> 01:19:42.770
league um with just every comp except the first

01:19:42.770 --> 01:19:46.149
one included so all right cool well um want to

01:19:46.149 --> 01:19:47.489
let people know where they can find you guys

01:19:47.489 --> 01:19:51.369
i mean i'm i'm usually on youtube emil abramson

01:19:51.369 --> 01:19:54.869
that's where they find me yeah i could be found

01:19:54.869 --> 01:19:58.569
on instagram my handle is cream monster with

01:19:58.569 --> 01:20:01.810
a k I'm not super active, but if you want to

01:20:01.810 --> 01:20:05.470
follow, I'm happy. Cool. Well, thank you again.

01:20:05.609 --> 01:20:08.489
Good chat. Thank you. Of course. Thank you. Thank

01:20:08.489 --> 01:20:11.090
you so much for making it to the end of the podcast.

01:20:11.489 --> 01:20:13.869
Don't forget to like and subscribe if you enjoyed.

01:20:14.130 --> 01:20:17.720
Otherwise, you are a super fake climber. If you're

01:20:17.720 --> 01:20:20.140
listening on a podcasting platform, I'd appreciate

01:20:20.140 --> 01:20:22.859
if you rate it five stars and you can continue

01:20:22.859 --> 01:20:25.640
the discussion on the free competition climbing

01:20:25.640 --> 01:20:28.640
discord linked in the description. Thanks again

01:20:28.640 --> 01:20:29.100
for listening.